Ace Frehley trying to play guitar for 30 minutes mumbling to himself (Video)

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Re: Ace Frehley trying to play guitar for 30 minutes mumbling to himself (Video)

Post by Glasgow Kiss »

I'm struggling to see what the point being made is here - 70 year old doesn't play as well as he did when he was 25 shock horror!? It's pretty clear that's the case with Ace these days...he's deaf as a post, he's clearly been robbed of some of his mental acuity by decades of abuse and although he still seems capable of bringing it some nights, at this point in time they're easily outnumbered by his off nights.

It's similar with virtually every act that's been namechecked on this thread...let's hear what actually Kiss sound like in 2021 tuned back up without the tapes. Same with DLR - shorn of his former athleticism and vocal power by the passage of time it's clear he's nowhere near the standard he was in the 70s and 80s. Ironically, the only one that still passes muster is Alice...he never was about jumping around and he never had much of a voice to start with.
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Re: Ace Frehley trying to play guitar for 30 minutes mumbling to himself (Video)

Post by wjs296 »

Glasgow Kiss wrote: Thu Sep 16, 2021 3:30 am I'm struggling to see what the point being made is here - 70 year old doesn't play as well as he did when he was 25 shock horror!? It's pretty clear that's the case with Ace these days...he's deaf as a post, he's clearly been robbed of some of his mental acuity by decades of abuse and although he still seems capable of bringing it some nights, at this point in time they're easily outnumbered by his off nights.

It's similar with virtually every act that's been namechecked on this thread...let's hear what actually Kiss sound like in 2021 tuned back up without the tapes. Same with DLR - shorn of his former athleticism and vocal power by the passage of time it's clear he's nowhere near the standard he was in the 70s and 80s. Ironically, the only one that still passes muster is Alice...he never was about jumping around and he never had much of a voice to start with.
Well stated!

I believe there are a few people that like to bring up the same old stuff to deflect criticism from Tommy, G&P as if it elevates them in some way. Ace is history is well known and there no excuses for it. I like his guitar playing and I have little interest in him as a person. I feel that way about all famous musicians and celebrities. The bottom line its that Ace is the lead guitarist that made Kiss a legend in the 70's. It was a long time ago but that period was the height of the popularity. Only the reunion has come close in terms of that hype in the general public. People still go see them today because of the legend that Ace helped create. Yes, he is not able to play like he used too but reposting the same old clips can never take that away from him.
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Re: Ace Frehley trying to play guitar for 30 minutes mumbling to himself (Video)

Post by StillAlive »

Doose wrote: Wed Sep 15, 2021 7:30 pm I don't think Ace could have ever handled the EOTR tour. Too unstable, too unpredictable, and at this point in their lives and careers, Gene and Paul don't need it.
It's rock and roll when you're 25. Not when you're 75. At some point Gene and Paul grew up. Ace never did. That's why Gene and Paul are worth millions, and Ace gloms off chicks and friends, and sells free guitars in hotels to unsuspecting fans.
This.
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Re: Ace Frehley trying to play guitar for 30 minutes mumbling to himself (Video)

Post by Supertrooper »

Glasgow Kiss wrote: Wed Sep 15, 2021 1:40 pm Most of the Vault guest appearances were pretty shambolic from everybody concerned from what I saw. I don't know whether some people were expecting some sort of professional MTV Unplugged scenario, but they tended to be more along the lines of a couple of people jamming half-songs badly.

Not sure why this one would be deemed particularly bad - the bar was pretty low.
Because it was even lower than usual
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Re: Ace Frehley trying to play guitar for 30 minutes mumbling to himself (Video)

Post by Mr Slow »

A KISS show has always been HEAVILY choreographed. Does anybody really think they just spontaneously did the Deuce dance? Or that Ace just randomly dropped to his knees while Gene & Paul stood over him, rocking back and forth? Or the choreography in God Of Thunder and Let Me Go RnR or Paul’s raps were just made up on the spot? It’s like some people are new to KISS! :lol:
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Re: Ace Frehley trying to play guitar for 30 minutes mumbling to himself (Video)

Post by Mr Slow »

wjs296 wrote: Thu Sep 16, 2021 4:30 am
Glasgow Kiss wrote: Thu Sep 16, 2021 3:30 am I'm struggling to see what the point being made is here - 70 year old doesn't play as well as he did when he was 25 shock horror!? It's pretty clear that's the case with Ace these days...he's deaf as a post, he's clearly been robbed of some of his mental acuity by decades of abuse and although he still seems capable of bringing it some nights, at this point in time they're easily outnumbered by his off nights.

It's similar with virtually every act that's been namechecked on this thread...let's hear what actually Kiss sound like in 2021 tuned back up without the tapes. Same with DLR - shorn of his former athleticism and vocal power by the passage of time it's clear he's nowhere near the standard he was in the 70s and 80s. Ironically, the only one that still passes muster is Alice...he never was about jumping around and he never had much of a voice to start with.
Well stated!

I believe there are a few people that like to bring up the same old stuff to deflect criticism from Tommy, G&P as if it elevates them in some way. Ace is history is well known and there no excuses for it. I like his guitar playing and I have little interest in him as a person. I feel that way about all famous musicians and celebrities. The bottom line its that Ace is the lead guitarist that made Kiss a legend in the 70's. It was a long time ago but that period was the height of the popularity. Only the reunion has come close in terms of that hype in the general public. People still go see them today because of the legend that Ace helped create. Yes, he is not able to play like he used too but reposting the same old clips can never take that away from him.
If it’s ok for some to bash the current bands frailties at every opportunity then surely it’s more than fine to criticise Ace when he sounds bad. Or is it all one way traffic?
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Re: Ace Frehley trying to play guitar for 30 minutes mumbling to himself (Video)

Post by TheKISSProject7312 »

Mr Slow wrote: Thu Sep 16, 2021 5:57 am
wjs296 wrote: Thu Sep 16, 2021 4:30 am
Glasgow Kiss wrote: Thu Sep 16, 2021 3:30 am I'm struggling to see what the point being made is here - 70 year old doesn't play as well as he did when he was 25 shock horror!? It's pretty clear that's the case with Ace these days...he's deaf as a post, he's clearly been robbed of some of his mental acuity by decades of abuse and although he still seems capable of bringing it some nights, at this point in time they're easily outnumbered by his off nights.

It's similar with virtually every act that's been namechecked on this thread...let's hear what actually Kiss sound like in 2021 tuned back up without the tapes. Same with DLR - shorn of his former athleticism and vocal power by the passage of time it's clear he's nowhere near the standard he was in the 70s and 80s. Ironically, the only one that still passes muster is Alice...he never was about jumping around and he never had much of a voice to start with.
Well stated!

I believe there are a few people that like to bring up the same old stuff to deflect criticism from Tommy, G&P as if it elevates them in some way. Ace is history is well known and there no excuses for it. I like his guitar playing and I have little interest in him as a person. I feel that way about all famous musicians and celebrities. The bottom line its that Ace is the lead guitarist that made Kiss a legend in the 70's. It was a long time ago but that period was the height of the popularity. Only the reunion has come close in terms of that hype in the general public. People still go see them today because of the legend that Ace helped create. Yes, he is not able to play like he used too but reposting the same old clips can never take that away from him.
If it’s ok for some to bash the current bands frailties at every opportunity then surely it’s more than fine to criticise Ace when he sounds bad. Or is it all one way traffic?
Exactly this.

That same post with "Ace" replaced with "Paul" would earn you nothing but scorn and ridicule.
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Re: Ace Frehley trying to play guitar for 30 minutes mumbling to himself (Video)

Post by Glasgow Kiss »

Mr Slow wrote: Thu Sep 16, 2021 5:57 am
wjs296 wrote: Thu Sep 16, 2021 4:30 am
Glasgow Kiss wrote: Thu Sep 16, 2021 3:30 am I'm struggling to see what the point being made is here - 70 year old doesn't play as well as he did when he was 25 shock horror!? It's pretty clear that's the case with Ace these days...he's deaf as a post, he's clearly been robbed of some of his mental acuity by decades of abuse and although he still seems capable of bringing it some nights, at this point in time they're easily outnumbered by his off nights.

It's similar with virtually every act that's been namechecked on this thread...let's hear what actually Kiss sound like in 2021 tuned back up without the tapes. Same with DLR - shorn of his former athleticism and vocal power by the passage of time it's clear he's nowhere near the standard he was in the 70s and 80s. Ironically, the only one that still passes muster is Alice...he never was about jumping around and he never had much of a voice to start with.
Well stated!

I believe there are a few people that like to bring up the same old stuff to deflect criticism from Tommy, G&P as if it elevates them in some way. Ace is history is well known and there no excuses for it. I like his guitar playing and I have little interest in him as a person. I feel that way about all famous musicians and celebrities. The bottom line its that Ace is the lead guitarist that made Kiss a legend in the 70's. It was a long time ago but that period was the height of the popularity. Only the reunion has come close in terms of that hype in the general public. People still go see them today because of the legend that Ace helped create. Yes, he is not able to play like he used too but reposting the same old clips can never take that away from him.
If it’s ok for some to bash the current bands frailties at every opportunity then surely it’s more than fine to criticise Ace when he sounds bad. Or is it all one way traffic?
I acknowledged that Ace seemingly has many more off nights than he does on nights these days. I don't think I ever saw this particular video, but I watched enough of the Vault events on Youtube to realise they' were poorly-executed throwaway half-jams rather than gigs per se...so it's probably a bad example to use as evidence, especially when there's so many phoned-in actual Ace live performances to choose from.

That's unfortunately part and parcel of an ageing (and let's be honest...declining) artist playing live. Current Kiss are getting round having to deal with an identical problem at the moment by not actually playing live in the true sense of the word. I don't find either one particularly edifying - in fact both are a bit sad to see - but if I had to pick one, I suppose there's a greater degree of honesty in what Ace is doing, poor though so many of his performances can be.
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Re: Ace Frehley trying to play guitar for 30 minutes mumbling to himself (Video)

Post by vinniestkulick »

How asinine that someone warming up, semi-privately, 3 yrs ago is considered dispositive... the negative Ace threads around here seem bottomless, and endless.
It's pathetic.
But he's about to step out in a big way... on the Alice tour, and folks starting threads like this might need to find something else to do, like start threads about former and current Kiss guitar players that have no solo careers whatsoever. Ace puts them to shame.
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Re: Ace Frehley trying to play guitar for 30 minutes mumbling to himself (Video)

Post by LoveGuns »

Why bash anyone tho? Arent we fans of this band? Arent they our guys? If Paul has vocal issues, we hope he pulls through. If Ace flubbs more notes lately, we hope hes well and that he will iron the wrinkles. If not kudos for them for still doing what they love, we're behind them. Right?
This pesky and often outright mean and heartless attacks on current or former band members, especiallt for any shirtcomings that are happening due to age or somethibg they cant control is puzzling
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Re: Ace Frehley trying to play guitar for 30 minutes mumbling to himself (Video)

Post by Grand Classic »

Mr Slow wrote: Thu Sep 16, 2021 5:54 am A KISS show has always been HEAVILY choreographed. Does anybody really think they just spontaneously did the Deuce dance? Or that Ace just randomly dropped to his knees while Gene & Paul stood over him, rocking back and forth? Or the choreography in God Of Thunder and Let Me Go RnR or Paul’s raps were just made up on the spot? It’s like some people are new to KISS! :lol:
Not this HEAVILY choreographed as what KISS has become. Stop making excuses for a formerly live band that isn't so live now. The whole show is fucked if cues are not perfectly followed. That is what happens with tapes.
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Re: Ace Frehley trying to play guitar for 30 minutes mumbling to himself (Video)

Post by jannep17 »

I think it's fair to criticize any or every member of Kiss when the playing isn't up to snuff.

We do have 70 and even 80 year old musicians going out every night, and they have rehearsed intensely to sound perfect.

Agreed, most of these 70 or 80 year old musicians are jazz or classical players but I don't see why it shouldn't apply to rock musicians as well.
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Re: Ace Frehley trying to play guitar for 30 minutes mumbling to himself (Video)

Post by LoveGuns »

jannep17 wrote: Thu Sep 16, 2021 10:08 am I think it's fair to criticize any or every member of Kiss when the playing isn't up to snuff.

We do have 70 and even 80 year old musicians going out every night, and they have rehearsed intensely to sound perfect.

Agreed, most of these 70 or 80 year old musicians are jazz or classical players but I don't see why it shouldn't apply to rock musicians as well.
Nothing wrong with critique or pointing shortcomings, but this is more akin to throwing tomatoes and ridiculing. Its the malicious tone of the criticism thats really not warranted against any human who perhpas cant help it with some issues. Everyone ages differently
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Re: Ace Frehley trying to play guitar for 30 minutes mumbling to himself (Video)

Post by wjs296 »

Mr Slow wrote: Thu Sep 16, 2021 5:57 am
wjs296 wrote: Thu Sep 16, 2021 4:30 am
Glasgow Kiss wrote: Thu Sep 16, 2021 3:30 am I'm struggling to see what the point being made is here - 70 year old doesn't play as well as he did when he was 25 shock horror!? It's pretty clear that's the case with Ace these days...he's deaf as a post, he's clearly been robbed of some of his mental acuity by decades of abuse and although he still seems capable of bringing it some nights, at this point in time they're easily outnumbered by his off nights.

It's similar with virtually every act that's been namechecked on this thread...let's hear what actually Kiss sound like in 2021 tuned back up without the tapes. Same with DLR - shorn of his former athleticism and vocal power by the passage of time it's clear he's nowhere near the standard he was in the 70s and 80s. Ironically, the only one that still passes muster is Alice...he never was about jumping around and he never had much of a voice to start with.
Well stated!

I believe there are a few people that like to bring up the same old stuff to deflect criticism from Tommy, G&P as if it elevates them in some way. Ace is history is well known and there no excuses for it. I like his guitar playing and I have little interest in him as a person. I feel that way about all famous musicians and celebrities. The bottom line its that Ace is the lead guitarist that made Kiss a legend in the 70's. It was a long time ago but that period was the height of the popularity. Only the reunion has come close in terms of that hype in the general public. People still go see them today because of the legend that Ace helped create. Yes, he is not able to play like he used too but reposting the same old clips can never take that away from him.
If it’s ok for some to bash the current bands frailties at every opportunity then surely it’s more than fine to criticise Ace when he sounds bad. Or is it all one way traffic?
I don't see any value in another thread about Paul's obvious vocal decline and lip syncing either. None of them are anywhere near their prime and they all have diminished skills. It seems senseless to keep these same issues brought back in new threads. What is really the point? Is there really much value in a conversation of an issue that is several years old and has been debated 100's times? You don't have to love everything the band does or every era of the band but why put so much energy into this crap.
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Re: Ace Frehley trying to play guitar for 30 minutes mumbling to himself (Video)

Post by SaintN'Sinner83 »

Grand Classic wrote: Thu Sep 16, 2021 10:04 am
Mr Slow wrote: Thu Sep 16, 2021 5:54 am A KISS show has always been HEAVILY choreographed. Does anybody really think they just spontaneously did the Deuce dance? Or that Ace just randomly dropped to his knees while Gene & Paul stood over him, rocking back and forth? Or the choreography in God Of Thunder and Let Me Go RnR or Paul’s raps were just made up on the spot? It’s like some people are new to KISS! :lol:
Not this HEAVILY choreographed as what KISS has become. Stop making excuses for a formerly live band that isn't so live now. The whole show is fucked if cues are not perfectly followed. That is what happens with tapes.
LOL even before Paul used a tape, you weren't giving them any credit.

Don't pretend the presence of Paul's lip synching has suddenly changed your feelings.

It just gave you different ammo for your usual shtick.
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Re: Ace Frehley trying to play guitar for 30 minutes mumbling to himself (Video)

Post by Grand Classic »

SaintN'Sinner83 wrote: Thu Sep 16, 2021 11:06 am
Grand Classic wrote: Thu Sep 16, 2021 10:04 am
Mr Slow wrote: Thu Sep 16, 2021 5:54 am A KISS show has always been HEAVILY choreographed. Does anybody really think they just spontaneously did the Deuce dance? Or that Ace just randomly dropped to his knees while Gene & Paul stood over him, rocking back and forth? Or the choreography in God Of Thunder and Let Me Go RnR or Paul’s raps were just made up on the spot? It’s like some people are new to KISS! :lol:
Not this HEAVILY choreographed as what KISS has become. Stop making excuses for a formerly live band that isn't so live now. The whole show is fucked if cues are not perfectly followed. That is what happens with tapes.
LOL even before Paul used a tape, you weren't giving them any credit.

Don't pretend the presence of Paul's lip synching has suddenly changed your feelings.

It just gave you different ammo for your usual shtick.
Have KISS really been worth praising in the last 20 years? No.

How much lower can a band go? KISS has the answer.

If you asked people before if they would ever accept ALL OF KISS (not just Paul) playing to a tape - they would say no fucking way with their first raised in triumph that KISS were above such things.

Then reality happened and the spines of some KISS fans broke and they said take my money anyway - lowered standards it is.
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Re: Ace Frehley trying to play guitar for 30 minutes mumbling to himself (Video)

Post by TheKISSProject7312 »

Other than that one video where Ace starts playing his own riffs and Gene gets pissy, can someone link me to some moments of glorious rock n' roll spontaneity that's missing with the current band*? I'm more than happy to be proved wrong, but it seems like the current product is pretty much business as usual when compared to say, the Reunion era, but with twenty plus more years on the clock.

Talking about stagecraft and musicianship here, mind, not vauge, nebulous "magic" brought by having the OG four.

*One caveat, said spontaneity has to *add* to the show. Peter drunkenly forgetting how Beth goes adds nothing positive.
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Re: Ace Frehley trying to play guitar for 30 minutes mumbling to himself (Video)

Post by caligari »

StillAlive wrote: Wed Sep 15, 2021 3:35 pm
sugardaddy wrote: Wed Sep 15, 2021 3:25 pm Was it as disappointing as Kruise appearance?
Well there's this:



viewtopic.php?t=130607
Oh my god what the hell is wrong…
Every song is actually slower
than the studio version and his playing is atrocious lol
do some people really want him back in KISS?
This is slower than Peter’s last go-round on the drums.
Last edited by caligari on Thu Sep 16, 2021 11:41 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Ace Frehley trying to play guitar for 30 minutes mumbling to himself (Video)

Post by SaintN'Sinner83 »

Same guy praises current Ace's guitar playing suddenly has standards when the conversation is on KISS.

:lol:
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Re: Ace Frehley trying to play guitar for 30 minutes mumbling to himself (Video)

Post by Grand Classic »

SaintN'Sinner83 wrote: Thu Sep 16, 2021 11:36 am Same guy praises current Ace's guitar playing suddenly has standards when the conversation is on KISS.

:lol:
I did?

When?

By the way - playing to a tape is a far greater sin and vastly more pathetic than just being sloppy and lazy live.

Ace is playing live and sure he can be really bad some nights, but man - KISS miming to a tape every night is kick ass somehow.

Make that makes sense.
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Re: Ace Frehley trying to play guitar for 30 minutes mumbling to himself (Video)

Post by SaintN'Sinner83 »

Paul is miming his vocals. Not a good thing, but the band isn't miming.

Like I said, you gave them endless shit before that - so don't act like this is the canned vocals is the final straw.
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Re: Ace Frehley trying to play guitar for 30 minutes mumbling to himself (Video)

Post by CStomp1 »

All the guys have limitations brought on mainly by age. The big difference is G&P have enough cabbage to be able to work within their limitations (primarily Paul's voice) and still put on a credible (if not incredible) KISS show. I bet when these guys are in a rehearsal space with everything stripped away, they still bring it musically. It really comes down to Paul's vocals.

Ace, unfortunately, doesn't have the ability to mask his shortcomings. They are always there for us to hear.
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Re: Ace Frehley trying to play guitar for 30 minutes mumbling to himself (Video)

Post by So Cruel »

CStomp1 wrote: Thu Sep 16, 2021 11:51 am All the guys have limitations brought on mainly by age. The big difference is G&P have enough cabbage to be able to work within their limitations (primarily Paul's voice) and still put on a credible (if not incredible) KISS show. I bet when these guys are in a rehearsal space with everything stripped away, they still bring it musically. It really comes down to Paul's vocals.

Ace, unfortunately, doesn't have the ability to mask his shortcomings. They are always there for us to hear.
So miming to a tape is “working within their limitations”?
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Re: Ace Frehley trying to play guitar for 30 minutes mumbling to himself (Video)

Post by Grand Classic »

SaintN'Sinner83 wrote: Thu Sep 16, 2021 11:49 am Paul is miming his vocals. Not a good thing, but the band isn't miming.

Like I said, you gave them endless shit before that - so don't act like this is the canned vocals is the final straw.
Miming vocals is the WORST thing a band can do.

The entire band is focused on playing to a tape. You know this. Gene, Eric and Tommy are not entirely live.

What has been worth praising about KISS prior to this?

Paul's shitty vocal decline for MANY years now? Tommy's sleep inducing playing and performance? Eric being obviously bored as fuck with KISS and would much rather be playing in Alice's band if the money was the same?

Please point me to all the highs that I have apparently missed.
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Re: Ace Frehley trying to play guitar for 30 minutes mumbling to himself (Video)

Post by CStomp1 »

So Cruel wrote: Thu Sep 16, 2021 11:57 am
CStomp1 wrote: Thu Sep 16, 2021 11:51 am All the guys have limitations brought on mainly by age. The big difference is G&P have enough cabbage to be able to work within their limitations (primarily Paul's voice) and still put on a credible (if not incredible) KISS show. I bet when these guys are in a rehearsal space with everything stripped away, they still bring it musically. It really comes down to Paul's vocals.

Ace, unfortunately, doesn't have the ability to mask his shortcomings. They are always there for us to hear.
So miming to a tape is “working within their limitations”?
I would say so. Paul is severely limited vocally so they've found a way to work around it. I'm not saying it's good or anything, but that's what it is.
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Re: Ace Frehley trying to play guitar for 30 minutes mumbling to himself (Video)

Post by gabbagabba »

caligari wrote: Thu Sep 16, 2021 11:34 am
StillAlive wrote: Wed Sep 15, 2021 3:35 pm
sugardaddy wrote: Wed Sep 15, 2021 3:25 pm Was it as disappointing as Kruise appearance?
Well there's this:



viewtopic.php?t=130607
Oh my god what the hell is wrong…
Every song is actually slower
than the studio version and his playing is atrocious lol
do some people really want him back in KISS?
This is slower than Peter’s last go-round on the drums.

It seems clear to me that Ace was under the influence of tranquilizers that night, maybe it wasn't one of his best days.
Normally he's not Mr. Energy, but he's really dull and slow here.
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Re: Ace Frehley trying to play guitar for 30 minutes mumbling to himself (Video)

Post by joma5477 »

Admittedly, I've not seen Ace since he hired Gene's band...and what I've seen online it looks like the result is him half-assing it and not showing up prepared...so it doesn't surprise me if it's not great these days. Prior to that, with his old band...Richie, Chris, and Scot, I saw Ace half a dozen times or so and it was always good and Ace was always 'on'. He was necessary to the band and showed up prepared. With a full band plus Ace, seems preparing is optional. If it's early in the tour, you may be getting a rough outing.
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Re: Ace Frehley trying to play guitar for 30 minutes mumbling to himself (Video)

Post by lord71 »

gabbagabba wrote: Thu Sep 16, 2021 12:13 pm
caligari wrote: Thu Sep 16, 2021 11:34 am
StillAlive wrote: Wed Sep 15, 2021 3:35 pm
sugardaddy wrote: Wed Sep 15, 2021 3:25 pm Was it as disappointing as Kruise appearance?
Well there's this:



viewtopic.php?t=130607
Oh my god what the hell is wrong…
Every song is actually slower
than the studio version and his playing is atrocious lol
do some people really want him back in KISS?
This is slower than Peter’s last go-round on the drums.

It seems clear to me that Ace was under the influence of tranquilizers that night, maybe it wasn't one of his best days.
Normally he's not Mr. Energy, but he's really dull and slow here.
This.

He was not 'ok'. Probably not booze, but something else. Perhaps too much 'stress' to make him look good in front of Gene and the he actually blew it. Gene surely is not the last person to notice this.
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Re: Ace Frehley trying to play guitar for 30 minutes mumbling to himself (Video)

Post by StillAlive »

SaintN'Sinner83 wrote: Wed Sep 15, 2021 6:54 pm Ace sucked.
He sounded like he had mittens on while playing.
Fat Frehley with mittens on.
Coming to a car dealership near you!

All kidding aside, Ace says he lost 25 pounds since 2019. He also says he rehearsed for a week for the Alice tour.
Hopefully 2021 is a better year for him.
Lord knows it can't get much worse.


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Re: Ace Frehley trying to play guitar for 30 minutes mumbling to himself (Video)

Post by SaintN'Sinner83 »

KISS may be playing to keep in time with Paul's backing track - but it's not like the pace of the songs or the playing has changed at all.

Not like KISS concerts were ever known for their off the cuff spontaneity prior to this tour. Whether that's 1974 or 2004.
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Re: Ace Frehley trying to play guitar for 30 minutes mumbling to himself (Video)

Post by So Cruel »

CStomp1 wrote: Thu Sep 16, 2021 12:10 pm
So Cruel wrote: Thu Sep 16, 2021 11:57 am
CStomp1 wrote: Thu Sep 16, 2021 11:51 am All the guys have limitations brought on mainly by age. The big difference is G&P have enough cabbage to be able to work within their limitations (primarily Paul's voice) and still put on a credible (if not incredible) KISS show. I bet when these guys are in a rehearsal space with everything stripped away, they still bring it musically. It really comes down to Paul's vocals.

Ace, unfortunately, doesn't have the ability to mask his shortcomings. They are always there for us to hear.
So miming to a tape is “working within their limitations”?
I would say so. Paul is severely limited vocally so they've found a way to work around it. I'm not saying it's good or anything, but that's what it is.
Miming to a tape is faking it, not working within limitations.
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Re: Ace Frehley trying to play guitar for 30 minutes mumbling to himself (Video)

Post by Grand Classic »

It really is amazing the total flip that happened here once KISS started miming.

They are doing the exact thing that they swore they would never do - while calling out other bands and artists and the KISS fans here raised their fist in triumph over that.

Some KISS fans just folded on their supposed standards so easily, can be bought and have completely changed their entire position on miming....because KISS is doing it now.

Make any excuses you want, but it's pathetic given your original stance that you were apparently rock solid on. You would NEVER pay to see a concert with a rock band playing to a tape.
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Re: Ace Frehley trying to play guitar for 30 minutes mumbling to himself (Video)

Post by SaintN'Sinner83 »

Everyone here, and I mean everyone - would prefer Paul doesn't use backing track vocals. Nobody was happy about it. Nobody.

But, it's been a couple years now. What the fuck can we do about it?
We can have fun pointing out where he missed a cue, but at the end of the day, we either have to let it bother us to no end or just accept that's what it is...and go or don't.

Many of us go.
Many of us don't.
Both are valid.

Same with Ace. Some love seeing Ace play, even poorly, because it's Ace and he's our guitar hero. I 100% understand that. And they have fun - and power to them.

I'm not going to browbeat them over their "low standards". Fuck that shit. As long as they don't piss on my popcorn, I won't do so to them.

What's pathetic is this obsession with everyone else having 'lower standards' than you to the point of which you have to make endless threads trying to bait people into disagreeing so you can shit on their different views.

Why do you give a shit if someone enjoys a modern KISS concert? You bitched before the backing tracks - and you're bitching now. What's the difference? Your mind has been made up for 20 years.

You seem to get off on calling people out because their standards are somehow not as high and mighty as yours. And if that's all you're doing - you can get fucked.

Seriously.

(You're the one yelling, in this image)

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Re: Ace Frehley trying to play guitar for 30 minutes mumbling to himself (Video)

Post by Mr Slow »

SaintN'Sinner83 wrote: Thu Sep 16, 2021 2:42 pm Everyone here, and I mean everyone - would prefer Paul doesn't use backing track vocals. Nobody was happy about it. Nobody.

But, it's been a couple years now. What the fuck can we do about it?
We can have fun pointing out where he missed a cue, but at the end of the day, we either have to let it bother us to no end or just accept that's what it is...and go or don't.

Many of us go.
Many of us don't.
Both are valid.

Same with Ace. Some love seeing Ace play, even poorly, because it's Ace and he's our guitar hero. I 100% understand that. And they have fun - and power to them.

I'm not going to browbeat them over their "low standards". Fuck that shit. As long as they don't piss on my popcorn, I won't do so to them.

What's pathetic is this obsession with everyone else having 'lower standards' than you to the point of which you have to make endless threads trying to bait people into disagreeing so you can shit on their different views.

Why do you give a shit if someone enjoys a modern KISS concert? You bitched before the backing tracks - and you're bitching now. What's the difference? Your mind has been made up for 20 years.

You seem to get off on calling people out because their standards are somehow not as high and mighty as yours. And if that's all you're doing - you can get fucked.

Seriously.

(You're the one yelling, in this image)

Image
Perfect in every aspect (especially the ‘get fucked’ part!) 😂