EOTR 2020 - Feb. 5, Buffalo, NY

[Admin]

Plan meetups, discuss/review the show, share the set list...

[Ghost_of_Paul_Lynde]

Groupon deal:
https://www.groupon.com/amp/deals/gl-ln ... ffalo-2020

[aceclone]

Plan meetups, discuss/review the show, share the set list...

For any FAQers that want to meet up before the show, my band is the hosting the pre-show party at a place called the Iron works, located right next door to the arena. Doors open at 4pm. They have limited food (pizza, etc.), but lots of drink and it's a close place to hang out if you're coming in from out of town or live in the area and want to get downtown before the 4:30-5:00 rush hour begins.

And we're also hosting the afterparty at the same venue, which starts at 11:00pm. KISS ends at 10:45pm and if you're looking for something to do after the show, the venue is literally a 2 minute walk once you exit the Key Bank Center.

[syracusekissfan]

Making the trip from Syracuse, sitting 4TH row center.

[acefan1975]

From Groupon:

"Highlights
Hard rockers behind the multiplatinum albums Destroyer and Hysteria perform chart-topping hits on a new tour; David Lee Roth joins"

lol

[Ghost_of_Paul_Lynde]

I was laughing at that lazy cut & paste job too...guess they just pulled up the blurb from that prior offer they had with Def Leppard.

[Spaceace]

Currently almost the entire 2nd row is available at $500 a seat. When will these go down? Fort Wayne went down to almost gave that a few weeks before that show.

[FlamingRuth]

I was laughing at that lazy cut & paste job too...guess they just pulled up the blurb from that prior offer they had with Def Leppard.

Or maybe they were just f-f-f-foolin’.

Have fun, guys.

[sugardaddy]

A buddy of mine who works at the venue just text me saying 5369 tix sold. Lower bowl only show

[Crown Royal]

A buddy of mine who works at the venue just text me saying 5369 tix sold. Lower bowl only show

Yikes, if true.

5,400 in Keybank's 19,000+ arena won't look too good.

Maybe a lot of walk-ups will help them out a bit.

[sugardaddy]

So those who paid for upper level seats are gonna get an upgrade

[brianj1974]

First row seats available currently...woof

[Sixxfan06]

Showed up to venue at 130 and all floor seats avail for 125 but front row

Scored some 6th row for 125 who cares how many people are in attendance I will rock out!

Them playing at Darien Lake last year killed this shows attendance

[RockRadio883]

I bought tickets in the 200s and now there are better seats same price, hoping for an exchange at the box office, I bought the tickets at the box office to begin with so I gotta wait til I get there, hope there is still something left.

[nibbler1982]

A buddy of mine who works at the venue just text me saying 5369 tix sold. Lower bowl only show

Nice sleuthing Brother Sugar!!!

I figured the upper bowl was sectioned off. When you look at a map and not ONE seat is available in the whole upper section that’s usually a dead giveaway.

I’m wondering if Groupons et al are included in that number? Either way, if you could get a final figure from him it would be greatly appreciated. I’d love to see how it stacks up against the boxscore. One of us had a contact at the O2 and he NAILED attendance EXACTLY with and without comps.

Nice job again brah.

[redinthesky]

From Groupon:

"Highlights
Hard rockers behind the multiplatinum albums Destroyer and Hysteria perform chart-topping hits on a new tour; David Lee Roth joins"

lol

Well, Kiss did do their 'version' of "Pour Some Sugar on Me" on the HITS album (not hating, I love most of the album).

Hope whoever is in Buffalo is having a good time!

[Wild Animals]

hopefully Dave will do Ladies Night in Buffalo! lol

[KLP68]

Any Buffalo NY show reports? Most of you are at work or in bed with a hangover

[Doose]

If they closed off the top level, it certainly didn't look like it. The arena looked full.

[acefan1975]

So was the set list the same as the night before?

[BeholderFan]

So was the set list the same as the night before?

Yes. I checked setlist.fm.

[hotterthanhell16]

Same setlist as the night before. KeyBank Center has 100, 200, and 300 levels. There was no one in the 300 level last night.

[KLP68]

If it was a smaller venue and it was 90% full then it was successful. So a large arena that isn’t sold to the rafters is a failure? Question being is what is the minimum number of fans to be considered a successful show? 10K-15K? Or whatever.

[nibbler1982]

If it was a smaller venue and it was 90% full then it was successful. So a large arena that isn’t sold to the rafters is a failure? Question being is what is the minimum number of fans to be considered a successful show? 10K-15K? Or whatever.

It’s all about gate vs guarantee Brother K.

Guarantees are based on how much money an artist can draw not on how many bodies are in the building.

Looking at the boxscores below you would think that Earth, Wind, & Fire would be a “failure” a per your question.

Journey & Def Leppard
KeyBank Center
Buffalo, N.Y.
May 26, 2018
$988,211
10,453

Panic! At The Disco, Two Feet, Betty Who KeyBank Center
Buffalo, N.Y.
Jan. 10, 2019
$810,443
14,310

Imagine Dragons
KeyBank Center
Buffalo, N.Y.
Nov. 1, 2017
$628,074
11,323

Earth, Wind & Fire
KeyBank Center
Buffalo, N.Y.
Aug. 11, 2017
$322,272
5,512

But for all we know their guarantee might be $250,000 and they’re the only ones that covered their nut. All the other bands that drew more may still have fallen short of earning their check.

[Fastcc]

Journey & Def Leppard
KeyBank Center
Buffalo, N.Y.
May 26, 2018
$988,211
10,453

Panic! At The Disco, Two Feet, Betty Who KeyBank Center
Buffalo, N.Y.
Jan. 10, 2019
$810,443
14,310

Imagine Dragons
KeyBank Center
Buffalo, N.Y.
Nov. 1, 2017
$628,074
11,323

Earth, Wind & Fire
KeyBank Center
Buffalo, N.Y.
Aug. 11, 2017
$322,272
5,512

"But for all we know their guarantee might be $250,000 and they’re the only ones that covered their nut. All the other bands that drew more may still have fallen short of earning their check."

All of those bands earned 100% of their check - regardless of the turnout - that's why it's called a guarantee. The amount is negotiated in advance and 50% is paid up front. The remaining 50% is wired after the show is complete - regardless of whether 10 0r 10,000 people show up. The promoter or venue are the only ones that takes a bath in a poor sales situations. That said, if enough promoters don't make their nut during a previous tour - subsequent negotiations for future tours are where the bands get their offers lowered.

[nibbler1982]

Journey & Def Leppard
KeyBank Center
Buffalo, N.Y.
May 26, 2018
$988,211
10,453

Panic! At The Disco, Two Feet, Betty Who KeyBank Center
Buffalo, N.Y.
Jan. 10, 2019
$810,443
14,310

Imagine Dragons
KeyBank Center
Buffalo, N.Y.
Nov. 1, 2017
$628,074
11,323

Earth, Wind & Fire
KeyBank Center
Buffalo, N.Y.
Aug. 11, 2017
$322,272
5,512

"But for all we know their guarantee might be $250,000 and they’re the only ones that covered their nut. All the other bands that drew more may still have fallen short of earning their check."

All of those bands earned 100% of their check - regardless of the turnout - that's why it's called a guarantee. The amount is negotiated in advance and 50% is paid up front. The remaining 50% is wired after the show is complete - regardless of whether 10 0r 10,000 people show up. The promoter or venue are the only ones that takes a bath in a poor sales situations. That said, if enough promoters don't make their nut during a previous tour - subsequent negotiations for future tours are where the bands get their offers lowered.

Ah.....No.

They would’ve RECEIVED 100% of their check.

But obviously not earned it because of falling short of the mark.

Well...obvious for most of us.

[Fastcc]

The bands listed in your post did indeed receive 100% of their check - that's how it works in today's industry - in which I happen to work. Your payout being tied to door sales is an obsolete practice at the level of the bands mentioned above - and certainly for KISS. Some very small clubs can still try and negotiate the door - but you'd be talking about small, insignificant local bands. There is zero risk for bands like KISS, EW&F, Panic! at the Disco, etc - they get paid the full amount negotiated, regardless of how many people show up.

[nibbler1982]

The bands listed in your post did indeed receive 100% of their check - that's how it works in today's industry - in which I happen to work. Your payout being tied to door sales is an obsolete practice at the level of the bands mentioned above - and certainly for KISS. Some very small clubs can still try and negotiate the door - but you'd be talking about small, insignificant local bands. There is zero risk for bands like KISS, EW&F, Panic! at the Disco, etc - they get paid the full amount negotiated, regardless of how many people show up.

None of what you said was ever in question. You’re apparently tilting at windmills.

You obviously have to go back and read the exchange between Brother K and myself.

Then come back and try again.

[Fastcc]

You are correct - I just wanted to make sure Brother K understood that the band gets paid regardless of the turnout.

Apologies for the confusion.

[nibbler1982]

You are correct - I just wanted to make sure Brother K understood that the band gets paid regardless of the turnout.

Apologies for the confusion.

No big deal brah.

I was concentrating on this aspect of his post...

“So a large arena that isn’t sold to the rafters is a failure? Question being is what is the minimum number of fans to be considered a successful show? 10K-15K? Or whatever.”

Buffalo could’ve been a “successful” show when all the totals come in. I was stressing that the gate is more on the promoters mind than the bodies in the building. Unless Live Nation set the guarantee counting on a sold out show at full ticket prices that is.

In that case whoever made that decision should also be fired IMMEDIATELY.

[Fastcc]

Lol - yes, I'm sure someone's sweating their job in Buffalo right now!

I will say that it is much harder to determine what the break-even is on the bigger venues with the dynamic pricing model that Ticketmaster uses these days. Plus, the venue does get the benefit of significant markups on draft beer and other vending, so even if the Groupon cuts into their revenue model, they can always hope to sell more $12 - $15 beers to help take a little bit of the sting out.

[nibbler1982]

Lol - yes, I'm sure someone's sweating their job in Buffalo right now!

I will say that it is much harder to determine what the break-even is on the bigger venues with the dynamic pricing model that Ticketmaster uses these days. Plus, the venue does get the benefit of significant markups on draft beer and other vending, so even if the Groupon cuts into their revenue model, they can always hope to sell more $12 - $15 beers to help take a little bit of the sting out.

I believe Groupon helps them get rid of some of the bulk they weren’t gonna move anyway. I think they welcome it.

As far of sweating in Buffalo?

I’ll reserve my right to make that decision after seeing the boxscore.

[Fastcc]

For sure - but the only problem with the box score is that you're only seeing gross receipts. The production rider is fluid by market due to the variance in things such as rider negotiation, local labor costs, concessionaire margin, permits and back line rental. You can't generate a true P&L statement without the specific cost of putting on the show, by venue.

[nibbler1982]

For sure - but the only problem with the box score is that you're only seeing gross receipts. The production rider is fluid by market due to the variance in things such as rider negotiation, local labor costs, concessionaire margin, permits and back line rental. You can't generate a true P&L statement without the specific cost of putting on the show, by venue.

Um...yeah.

But Live Nation have already taken that all into consideration when setting a guarantee throughout however many dates on the tour.

I would’ve expected you to already understand that if you’re gonna get as in-depth and knowledgeable as you’re trying to appear.

[Crown Royal]

If it was a smaller venue and it was 90% full then it was successful. So a large arena that isn’t sold to the rafters is a failure? Question being is what is the minimum number of fans to be considered a successful show? 10K-15K? Or whatever.

...and we watch the goalposts move


Should be a common occurrence this leg, I fear

[Spaceace]

Let me start by saying I don’t know much about the financials of a tour so i appreciate this thread.

So understand that the promoter pays KISS a rate or guarantee to perform. So the promoter then rents the building, works with Ticketmaster, advertises, etc...? Does KISS pay expenses related to their show (pyro, crew, travel, etc...) out of their guarantee?

[Ghost_of_Paul_Lynde]

For sure - but the only problem with the box score is that you're only seeing gross receipts. The production rider is fluid by market due to the variance in things such as rider negotiation, local labor costs, concessionaire margin, permits and back line rental. You can't generate a true P&L statement without the specific cost of putting on the show, by venue.

Thank you for your willingness to share your insight, Fastcc. Your efforts are indeed appreciated.

[sugardaddy]

Roughly 8000 attended

[tazchris]

That's a good turn out seeing as they hit Derian Lake last year. Nothing wrong with 8000.

[Tallbear13]

Yea nothing wrong with that

[nibbler1982]

Roughly 8000 attended

Thanks brah.