How Kiss sounded live Animalize thru HITS...

robertoamore · Post by **robertoamore** » Fri Aug 17, 2007 8:47 am

I've only seen the Animalize VHS, CN footage from K2 and did see the HITS tour live, so I'm missing Asylum perspective altogether.

I think they sound great on Animalize vhs and HITS from K2-

How did Kiss change or progress in those years in your eyes- or was it always the same sounding group tour after tour from 84 to 90?

styxter · Post by **styxter** » Fri Aug 17, 2007 8:53 am

I thought they were the best during that time. They had so much energy on stage in the 80's. The Revenge show was great too. Only complaint I have about the Revenge era is that Eric Carr wasn't there. Unholy and Hate off of C.O.S. is Gene at his finest.

gvermin · Post by **gvermin** » Fri Aug 17, 2007 9:53 am

Boy do the opinions vary on this board (which is a good thing). I can barely watch the 1984-1990 version of KISS for four reasons. I do not like the tone of Bruce Kulick's guitar. I do not like the triggered sound of Eric Carr's drums. The outfits look ridiculous (I thought this even back then). And, the classic songs were played at a blazing fast speed that lacked the swagger of the original songs.

HankHabanero · Post by **HankHabanero** » Fri Aug 17, 2007 9:57 am

I saw them on the Asylum tour and left the show early because the sound was the worst I've ever heard, even for a loud arena rock band. It could've just been that one show but I doubt it.

Most of you know I'm biased to the original band and the makeup era, but I did like some of the things they put out in the '80s, just not the majority of it. They didn't hold a candle live to the original four in my book. The band lost THE SOUND.

Destroyer · Post by **Destroyer** » Fri Aug 17, 2007 11:13 am

gvermin wrote:Boy do the opinions vary on this board (which is a good thing). I can barely watch the 1984-1990 version of KISS for four reasons. I do not like the tone of Bruce Kulick's guitar. I do not like the triggered sound of Eric Carr's drums. The outfits look ridiculous (I thought this even back then). And, the classic songs were played at a blazing fast speed that lacked the swagger of the original songs.

I did'nt think Eric's drum sound was triggered in 84?? I just don't buy it.Certainly sounds as if they were on the HITS tour though.I don't mind the faster tempo's either btw.Time to upgrade there old tunes or die out imo

I notice nobody seems to mind the huge increase in the tempo during the 77/78 Love Gun/Alive 2 tour

Mr. Blackwell · Post by **Mr. Blackwell** » Fri Aug 17, 2007 11:38 am

Having seen the shows in person, I loved the 'updated' feel of the songs. As Paul admits when talking about Mark St. John, they were trying to be relevant in the 80's. The energy at those shows was awesome!

Now if you are going to take an original recording and do a measure by measure comparison to the live 80's versions, yes they are different. But I will contend until eternity that witnessing a big, overblown arena concert is a completely different experience than watching it on television in your living room several years later.

No I'm not crazy about the snare drum sound on the HITS show, but in all honesty, as loud as the show was, I don't remember it sounding like that in person.

Paul embellished many vocal lines, but I remember at the concerts thinking that was great! (Afterall I had heard the recorded versions so many times!).

As for Bruce Kulick's guitar tone, I have read others here say they dislike it. I'm curious - do you mean his playing tone - vibrato, articulation; or his sound - amp, guitar??

Because to me, I think his touch is excellent - controlled vibrato, good phrasing - and his sound is actually more raw and less processed than other guitarists at that time.

Destroyer · Post by **Destroyer** » Fri Aug 17, 2007 11:44 am

Mr. Blackwell wrote:Having seen the shows in person, I loved the 'updated' feel of the songs. As Paul admits when talking about Mark St. John, they were trying to be relevant in the 80's. The energy at those shows was awesome!

Now if you are going to take an original recording and do a measure by measure comparison to the live 80's versions, yes they are different. But I will contend until eternity that witnessing a big, overblown arena concert is a completely different experience than watching it on television in your living room several years later.

No I'm not crazy about the snare drum sound on the HITS show, but in all honesty, as loud as the show was, I don't remember it sounding like that in person.
.

Very true.Things do sound very different when your there.

robertoamore · Post by **robertoamore** » Fri Aug 17, 2007 12:03 pm

gvermin wrote:Boy do the opinions vary on this board (which is a good thing). I can barely watch the 1984-1990 version of KISS for four reasons. I do not like the tone of Bruce Kulick's guitar. I do not like the triggered sound of Eric Carr's drums. The outfits look ridiculous (I thought this even back then). And, the classic songs were played at a blazing fast speed that lacked the swagger of the original songs.

It's funny- I understand and acknowledge these points. But having associated that era with so much positive feeling, all that stuff still makes me feel good. The other side is when you got to know kiss. I probably absorbed the '84 animalize versions fully before I'd absorbed the classic versions. i had that videotape and played like crazy- probably just taped it off mtv, actually- but it's so long i don't recall. Anyway- I didn't have any classic kiss on video until Exposed came out.

daltonic1 · Post by **daltonic1** » Fri Aug 17, 2007 12:18 pm

kiss changed their sound w/ each album to go with whatever trend was selling well during that year or two.

1976 · Post by **1976** » Fri Aug 17, 2007 1:20 pm

As much as I love the HITS era (one of the best KISS eras makeup or not), I really hate their guitar sound from Animalize to HITS. It's definitely a sign of the times of course, but I have a real hard time with it. Basically, it's horrible LOL.

125 · Post by **125** » Fri Aug 17, 2007 1:34 pm

As much I loved the improvement of the technical drumming of Carr over Criss, I can't stand some of the drumming on a lot of the 80's footage.
Tempos are set too fast, but I think G & P might have had something to do with that. But, too many drum fills on a lot of it. I want to hear the singer sing and the guitar on a solo, rather than a constant of fill variations throughout a song. It was this, along with the tempos, that didn't quite catch "the groove" for me to enjoy listening to the songs.
Don't castrate me for writing this. Just opinion.

I've got a question... Some of you refer to the narrations/commentaries by G & P during some of the footage. I'm not getting that on my KISSII video. Am I missing something on the dvd?

Destroyer · Post by **Destroyer** » Fri Aug 17, 2007 1:37 pm

125 wrote:As much I loved the improvement of the technical drumming of Carr over Criss, I can't stand some of the drumming on a lot of the 80's footage.
Tempos are set too fast, but I think G & P might have had something to do with that. But, too many drum fills on a lot of it. I want to hear the singer sing and the guitar on a solo, rather than a constant of fill variations throughout a song. It was this, along with the tempos, that didn't quite catch "the groove" for me to enjoy listening to the songs.
Don't castrate me for writing this. Just opinion.

I've got a question... Some of you refer to the narrations/commentaries by G & P during some of the footage. I'm not getting that on my KISSII video. Am I missing something on the dvd?

There should be some audio options on the dvd's.Just select comentary from those options.

19bones75 · Post by **19bones75** » Fri Aug 17, 2007 2:28 pm

Bruce brought in that cliche 80s all MIDs guitar tone. By the time they got to Revenge it got better.

Vinnie, in my opinion, had a much better tone in KISS. That line-up was so aggressive. It's interesting that Vinnie did the shred thing but he didn't adopt that 80s shredder all mids tone.

That said...I love Bruce and I love the shows with him on KISSOLOGY 2. it's just what was going on at the time I guess.

SickMagic · Post by **SickMagic** » Fri Aug 17, 2007 2:43 pm

I totally agree with you, 125!

I liked Eric's drumming on Creatures a lot. But to this day I feel uncomfortable when I hear Eric Carr doing the old stuff.

Just saw Sydney'80 today again and it just doesn't work for me. I don't hate it and I still enjoy it, but it just doesn't sound right to me.

I prefer Peter's style or Eric Singer like he's playing nowadays.

Oh well, it all depends on how you're used to it, I guess...

acevog75 · Post by **acevog75** » Fri Aug 17, 2007 4:28 pm

i was not impressed with their live performances in the 80's. way too fast and they played the origianl songs a half step in key higher. unfortunately i didn't think eric carr's drumming on the old songs did them justice. i think one of the reasons why they played fast was they were trying to keep up with all the new bands of the day. back in the 80's, not many metal fans were into the sound of the 70's so kiss really updated those old songs to give them a more metal feel. not my cup of tea. however, when the hits tour came around, i thought they were getting back on track and caring about their sound again.

MovieDemon · Post by **MovieDemon** » Fri Aug 17, 2007 4:46 pm

I actually just answered this on a different thread, so here's a little copy and paste action:

On the Animalize tour, the band were exceptionally energetic and sounded tight. I wish that tour could've been showcased on K2. Despite the lackluster album and ridiculous get-up of "Asylum," KISS were still a tight unit on tour. Fun and energetic. By the "Crazy Nights" tour - more often than not - that energy and fun seemed to have evaporated.

I think KISS - more specifically, Paul and Gene - were expecting/hoping for "Crazy Nights" to be a HUGE album. When it only marginally succeeded the previous effort, I do believe that sucked the energy and fun out of it for Paul and Gene. Just my personal observation, however, I could be wrong.

By "H.I.T.S." I believe it when Paul and Gene say that they had become comfortable of who they were and where they were going. I really think that is evident on the "H.I.T.S." tour.

Sam T Serpent · Post by **Sam T Serpent** » Fri Aug 17, 2007 5:00 pm

its funny when people say they lost the feel of the 70s song in the 80s but with Gene, Paul,Peter and Ace they really lost the feel of the 80s songs they were playing on the farewell tour... (listen to Heavens On Fire) on the Millenium show

trendkiller · Post by **trendkiller** » Fri Aug 17, 2007 5:03 pm

Mr. Blackwell wrote:As for Bruce Kulick's guitar tone, I have read others here say they dislike it. I'm curious - do you mean his playing tone - vibrato, articulation; or his sound - amp, guitar??

Because to me, I think his touch is excellent - controlled vibrato, good phrasing - and his sound is actually more raw and less processed than other guitarists at that time.

well, i love his technique, but his sound annoys me. it's like, he used too much Chorus, his guitar sounded pretty 'brilliant', and i can't stand the reverb. now he set his stuff a lil' bit different. his tone on revenge was amazing tho. he used and OD, Wah, analog delay and sometime chorus. check the overdistorted guitar on Paralyzed (central track) or his solo in Domino.

awawaw · Post by **awawaw** » Sat Aug 18, 2007 6:28 am

i didnt like the gutiar sound from 84-89. it just didnt sound like kiss, but then again what is the kiss sound? nearly every album sounds different.
Kiss Alive is kiss for my money.