KISS Nostalgia Band - why?

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KISS Nostalgia Band - why?

Post by Berninio »

As it is pretty clear, KISS is purely a nostalgia band since 2000 (maybe even before that). Why did G&P stop being creative and putting out new KISS music? If you look at bands like Judas Priest and Iron Maiden that have reunited and have been around for as long as KISS (JP longer, IM shorter), they are still creating new music and moving the bands forward. So, why couldn't/wouldn't G&P do that? Motörhead, Saxon, Accept, Scorpions, Rush, yeah even bands like Motley Crue, Van Halen, Black Sabbath, etc. (to a lesser extend) brought out new albums fairly regularly.
As a musician on any level creating new music is once bread and butter, therefore I don't get the 'stop being creative" thing from G&P.
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Re: KISS Nostalgia Band - why?

Post by His Majesty »

Because they make more money slapping the Destroyer album cover on BBQ grill sets and tennis shoes.
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Re: KISS Nostalgia Band - why?

Post by Anomaly »

What they were selling starting in 1996 wasn't the music, but the spectacle. The spectacle sells quite well.
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Re: KISS Nostalgia Band - why?

Post by Mike5477 »

They get off on the live performances. And let's face it, that's where the money is. Bands today (even large well known bands) get squat for releasing material now. KISS recorded albums because they had to. But being in front of the people, bringing them the live shows.....that's what it's all about for them now. And I have no problem with it.
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Re: KISS Nostalgia Band - why?

Post by Man of a Thousand Aces »

I don't think it was ever 'about' the music for them. The music was a means to an end, along with everything else that went with their packaging. They've gotten all they can and at this point there is no reason for them to put out new music, because as you said, they are a nostalgia band. Nothing wrong with that. Most people that go to see them these days are casual fans, who are there to hear "Love Gun" nd not new stuff. Besides, with Paul's voice, new music seems to be pointless.
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Re: KISS Nostalgia Band - why?

Post by Marty Scurll »

I use to think like this and wanted new material on a regular basis. Then after SB and Monster im good. That'll be enough. Ill shut up now. Not to mention most new shit sucks no matter the band. so be an nostalgic act and start releasing vintage box sets and DVDS or what have you. Im good with that now.
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Re: KISS Nostalgia Band - why?

Post by Tallbear13 »

Berninio wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 1:46 pm As it is pretty clear, KISS is purely a nostalgia band since 2000 (maybe even before that). Why did G&P stop being creative and putting out new KISS music? If you look at bands like Judas Priest and Iron Maiden that have reunited and have been around for as long as KISS (JP longer, IM shorter), they are still creating new music and moving the bands forward. So, why couldn't/wouldn't G&P do that? Motörhead, Saxon, Accept, Scorpions, Rush, yeah even bands like Motley Crue, Van Halen, Black Sabbath, etc. (to a lesser extend) brought out new albums fairly regularly.
As a musician on any level creating new music is once bread and butter, therefore I don't get the 'stop being creative" thing from G&P.
Same as Guns n Roses , fans would love new music from the band now but people are going to shows hearing the hits and are happy for now
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Re: KISS Nostalgia Band - why?

Post by StillAlive »

Nostalgia sells.
Look at recent setlists from other huge acts (Elton John, Billy Joel, Eagles, Fleetwood Mac, Rolling Stones, etc.).
People aren't attending for the new songs.

p.s. the record industry is a dumpster fire
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Re: KISS Nostalgia Band - why?

Post by Pete2174 »

StillAlive wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 2:08 pm Nostalgia sells.
Look at recent setlists from other huge acts (Elton John, Billy Joel, Eagles, Fleetwood Mac, Rolling Stones, etc.).
People aren't attending for the new songs.

p.s. the record industry is a dumpster fire
Was gonna say similar. People like looking back.
And yeah, the record industry is a dumpster fire. How many units do you need to sell to get a #1 record these days?
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Re: KISS Nostalgia Band - why?

Post by Tommyr »

Berninio wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 1:46 pm As it is pretty clear, KISS is purely a nostalgia band since 2000 (maybe even before that). Why did G&P stop being creative and putting out new KISS music? If you look at bands like Judas Priest and Iron Maiden that have reunited and have been around for as long as KISS (JP longer, IM shorter), they are still creating new music and moving the bands forward. So, why couldn't/wouldn't G&P do that? Motörhead, Saxon, Accept, Scorpions, Rush, yeah even bands like Motley Crue, Van Halen, Black Sabbath, etc. (to a lesser extend) brought out new albums fairly regularly.
As a musician on any level creating new music is once bread and butter, therefore I don't get the 'stop being creative" thing from G&P.
They've already explained it. Go read about it. Plus Paul can't sing Kiss stuff anymore. His voice is TOTALLY fucked. Get over it and move on.
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Re: KISS Nostalgia Band - why?

Post by dtk07 »

Kiss busted their ass creatively to diminishing returns in the 80s and early 90s only to be saved by turning to the greatest hits with the reunion tour. Slightly short sided but new music doesn't pay the bills.

I wished they would have recorded more from 1996-2009 but Gene & Paul confuse sales with the musical impact on their legacy by staying creative.
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Re: KISS Nostalgia Band - why?

Post by Coventry1973 »

Doesn't matter if they put out new music. For a bit fans will like it, but eventually it will go by the wayside and nothing special will come about it. When you go to a KISS concert, and they play songs off Sonic Boom or Monster, those are the songs that really don't go over well. Same deal if they put out a new album, you really think those new songs will be accepted over the classics? Remember what happened a few years back with Iron Maiden? They pretty much played 7-8 songs off their new album in concert, and fans were PISSED.
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Re: KISS Nostalgia Band - why?

Post by KISSFACE »

Berninio wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 1:46 pm As a musician on any level creating new music is once bread and butter, therefore I don't get the 'stop being creative" thing from G&P.
They chased the Money, and they still eventually put out two new albums that you have overlooked in the meantime. If Paul's voice wasn't broken, I believe there'd easily be a couple more new KISS albums by now. As it is, they're at least gonna dip toes into musical creativity again for the new KISS film's Soundtrack, with Bob Ezrin producing.

And if that goes well, who knows, maybe that leads to one more Album (as it did in '91-'92 — from Bill & Ted's soundtrack to REVENGE). And in that case — KISS 50, take my money!
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Re: KISS Nostalgia Band - why?

Post by battra »

Berninio wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 1:46 pm As it is pretty clear, KISS is purely a nostalgia band since 2000 (maybe even before that). Why did G&P stop being creative and putting out new KISS music? If you look at bands like Judas Priest and Iron Maiden that have reunited and have been around for as long as KISS (JP longer, IM shorter), they are still creating new music and moving the bands forward. So, why couldn't/wouldn't G&P do that? Motörhead, Saxon, Accept, Scorpions, Rush, yeah even bands like Motley Crue, Van Halen, Black Sabbath, etc. (to a lesser extend) brought out new albums fairly regularly.
As a musician on any level creating new music is once bread and butter, therefore I don't get the 'stop being creative" thing from G&P.
Simple.

It's an easy way to make money.

Making records isn't the money endeavor it once was...so...

Because music isn't as important to them as I wish it was...they don't bother.
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Re: KISS Nostalgia Band - why?

Post by battra »

Coventry1973 wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 3:09 pm Remember what happened a few years back with Iron Maiden? They pretty much played 7-8 songs off their new album in concert, and fans were PISSED.
I saw that tour and didn't experience what you're stating.

Maiden does heritage tour, new album tour, heritage tour, new album tour, etc...

Genius.

But it's always been about music for them.
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Re: KISS Nostalgia Band - why?

Post by Coventry1973 »

battra wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 3:26 pm
Coventry1973 wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 3:09 pm Remember what happened a few years back with Iron Maiden? They pretty much played 7-8 songs off their new album in concert, and fans were PISSED.
I saw that tour and didn't experience what you're stating.

Maiden does heritage tour, new album tour, heritage tour, new album tour, etc...

Genius.

But it's always been about music for them.
Yeah it might have been the new album tour, but my friends went to it and they were all extremely upset because they did not really want to hear all those songs off the new album. They said most of the people there felt the same way.
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Re: KISS Nostalgia Band - why?

Post by battra »

Bands have always made more money on tour than in the studio.

That's why Kiss spend a month (maximum) in the studio and 6 months on the road....

Kiss will always chase the easy dollar.

As I said earlier, I wish music was more important to them
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Re: KISS Nostalgia Band - why?

Post by battra »

Coventry1973 wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 3:28 pm
battra wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 3:26 pm
Coventry1973 wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 3:09 pm Remember what happened a few years back with Iron Maiden? They pretty much played 7-8 songs off their new album in concert, and fans were PISSED.
I saw that tour and didn't experience what you're stating.

Maiden does heritage tour, new album tour, heritage tour, new album tour, etc...

Genius.

But it's always been about music for them.
Yeah it might have been the new album tour, but my friends went to it and they were all extremely upset because they did not really want to hear all those songs off the new album. They said most of the people there felt the same way.
Why in the world did they go to the tour if they didn't want to hear the new album?

Maiden did the same thing they always do...played about half the record with some classics sprinkled in...what were they expecting???
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Re: KISS Nostalgia Band - why?

Post by Coventry1973 »

battra wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 3:30 pm
Coventry1973 wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 3:28 pm
battra wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 3:26 pm
Coventry1973 wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 3:09 pm Remember what happened a few years back with Iron Maiden? They pretty much played 7-8 songs off their new album in concert, and fans were PISSED.
I saw that tour and didn't experience what you're stating.

Maiden does heritage tour, new album tour, heritage tour, new album tour, etc...

Genius.

But it's always been about music for them.
Yeah it might have been the new album tour, but my friends went to it and they were all extremely upset because they did not really want to hear all those songs off the new album. They said most of the people there felt the same way.
Why in the world did they go to the tour if they didn't want to hear the new album?

Maiden did the same thing they always do...played about half the record with some classics sprinkled in...what were they expecting???
I guess more classics with a couple new ones sprinkled in
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Re: KISS Nostalgia Band - why?

Post by HOFCity »

Out of anything new I could find out about this band- past, present, photos, stories ect.

Why did G&P stop being creative and putting out new KISS music?

^^^ Would be my number 1
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Re: KISS Nostalgia Band - why?

Post by battra »

Coventry1973 wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 3:32 pm
battra wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 3:30 pm
Coventry1973 wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 3:28 pm
battra wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 3:26 pm

I saw that tour and didn't experience what you're stating.

Maiden does heritage tour, new album tour, heritage tour, new album tour, etc...

Genius.

But it's always been about music for them.
Yeah it might have been the new album tour, but my friends went to it and they were all extremely upset because they did not really want to hear all those songs off the new album. They said most of the people there felt the same way.
Why in the world did they go to the tour if they didn't want to hear the new album?

Maiden did the same thing they always do...played about half the record with some classics sprinkled in...what were they expecting???
I guess more classics with a couple new ones sprinkled in
So they were hoping for Iron Maiden to make a U-Turn rather than doing the same thing they'd been doing for almost 20 years continuous at that point?

Personally, I wasn't a big fan of Book of Souls at the time. I looked long and hard at the setlist before I dropped my bucks on the ticket, but I'm glad I did.
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Re: KISS Nostalgia Band - why?

Post by Planet Caravan »

It was actually 1998 & Psycho Circus which was the turning point.

I remember after the Reunion tour ended all anyone could talk about was when will a Reunion album happen. And the fact that Paul and Gene started the wheels moving on a new album shows that in 1997/98 at least, they also still believed that making albums was still an important part of Kiss.

However the relative failure of Psycho Circus must have really knocked their confidence and make them realise it's not worth the effort making new music when they can just make more money touring.

Its just sad that to this day they probably still don't understand the fans wanted a proper Reunion album not a fake record with session guys.
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Re: KISS Nostalgia Band - why?

Post by StillAlive »

KISS are instantly recognizable icons.
Let's face it, more famous for brand, image, show and attitude. The spectacle.
Huge mainstream, general public appeal.
They don't need die-hards to show up to every concert. They get plenty of casual fans (from 7 to 70).

Maiden, not so much. More of a niche group (not in a bad way).
Known more for their musical virtuosity, musicianship and songwriting. The music matters. The songs matter. That's their "business model" to a large extent.
Hell, they have Steve Harris. Nuff said.
They need to stay fresh (new music) to stay relevant. More so than a band like KISS anyway.
Last edited by StillAlive on Thu Sep 23, 2021 10:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: KISS Nostalgia Band - why?

Post by Anomaly »

battra wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 3:29 pm Bands have always made more money on tour than in the studio.

That's why Kiss spend a month (maximum) in the studio and 6 months on the road....

Kiss will always chase the easy dollar.

As I said earlier, I wish music was more important to them
Hell, there's some bands out there who have barely seen a dime from their record contracts.
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Re: KISS Nostalgia Band - why?

Post by Berninio »

Tommyr wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 2:44 pm
Berninio wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 1:46 pm As it is pretty clear, KISS is purely a nostalgia band since 2000 (maybe even before that). Why did G&P stop being creative and putting out new KISS music? If you look at bands like Judas Priest and Iron Maiden that have reunited and have been around for as long as KISS (JP longer, IM shorter), they are still creating new music and moving the bands forward. So, why couldn't/wouldn't G&P do that? Motörhead, Saxon, Accept, Scorpions, Rush, yeah even bands like Motley Crue, Van Halen, Black Sabbath, etc. (to a lesser extend) brought out new albums fairly regularly.
As a musician on any level creating new music is once bread and butter, therefore I don't get the 'stop being creative" thing from G&P.
They've already explained it. Go read about it. Plus Paul can't sing Kiss stuff anymore. His voice is TOTALLY fucked. Get over it and move on.
I think the "new music doesn't sell" argument is very stale and does not apply to KISS, as money can't be the driver anymore since 1996' Reunion tour. I understand that especially Gene is very shallow when it comes to money, even though he is an educated guy, and that he does not care about credibility (or does he?? - why go out of your way to get exposure on every level, state over and over again what smart business and financial decision one made, etc., if credibility is not what you are after? - same for Paul). The "KISS have the most Gold albums in America right behind the Beatles" statement is glaring evidence of that - why bother if one doesn't care about credibility? And KISS has no credibility in a musical sense anymore. I became a KISS fan because of the music - I had no idea how they looked.
As one poster wrote, I think they lost they songwriting mojo and are scared as shit to release anything new. Sales don't come into the equation - zero, nada. KISS could always cover their cost for producing an album and could still do the very exciting show with enough old hits. And there would be lot's more new concert staples/hits with the increased churn out. Deuce, Firehouse, Rock n Roll all nite, Shout it out loud, I love it loud, Heaven's on fire, etc, yes even Say Yeah (went over well at each KISS gig I went to) were once new songs and became concert staples.
PS: I think they did pretty decent with Sonic Boom and Monster (I like Monster - "Freak" is my favourite Paul song on there).
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Re: KISS Nostalgia Band - why?

Post by Legsofsteel »

Berninio wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 1:46 pm As it is pretty clear, KISS is purely a nostalgia band since 2000 (maybe even before that). Why did G&P stop being creative and putting out new KISS music? If you look at bands like Judas Priest and Iron Maiden that have reunited and have been around for as long as KISS (JP longer, IM shorter), they are still creating new music and moving the bands forward. So, why couldn't/wouldn't G&P do that? Motörhead, Saxon, Accept, Scorpions, Rush, yeah even bands like Motley Crue, Van Halen, Black Sabbath, etc. (to a lesser extend) brought out new albums fairly regularly.
As a musician on any level creating new music is once bread and butter, therefore I don't get the 'stop being creative" thing from G&P.
Motley Crue's last studio album was in 2008. Van Halen's in 2012.

KISS Monster was in 2012. Strange to include those two bands considering they have barely released any new material since the 80s. They seem to be fairly similar in regards to KISS and releasing new material.
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Re: KISS Nostalgia Band - why?

Post by Berninio »

Legsofsteel wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 4:24 pm
Berninio wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 1:46 pm As it is pretty clear, KISS is purely a nostalgia band since 2000 (maybe even before that). Why did G&P stop being creative and putting out new KISS music? If you look at bands like Judas Priest and Iron Maiden that have reunited and have been around for as long as KISS (JP longer, IM shorter), they are still creating new music and moving the bands forward. So, why couldn't/wouldn't G&P do that? Motörhead, Saxon, Accept, Scorpions, Rush, yeah even bands like Motley Crue, Van Halen, Black Sabbath, etc. (to a lesser extend) brought out new albums fairly regularly.
As a musician on any level creating new music is once bread and butter, therefore I don't get the 'stop being creative" thing from G&P.
Motley Crue's last studio album was in 2008. Van Halen's in 2012.

KISS Monster was in 2012. Strange to include those two bands considering they have barely released any new material since the 80s. They seem to be fairly similar in regards to KISS and releasing new material.
I concede on that one, but it does not deter from the fact that other bands have stayed musically relevant to a certain extent.
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Re: KISS Nostalgia Band - why?

Post by Goodwilltowardsall »

Berninio wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 1:46 pm As it is pretty clear, KISS is purely a nostalgia band since 2000 (maybe even before that). Why did G&P stop being creative and putting out new KISS music? If you look at bands like Judas Priest and Iron Maiden that have reunited and have been around for as long as KISS (JP longer, IM shorter), they are still creating new music and moving the bands forward. So, why couldn't/wouldn't G&P do that? Motörhead, Saxon, Accept, Scorpions, Rush, yeah even bands like Motley Crue, Van Halen, Black Sabbath, etc. (to a lesser extend) brought out new albums fairly regularly.
As a musician on any level creating new music is once bread and butter, therefore I don't get the 'stop being creative" thing from G&P.
I am sure that many others have already written this, but, again money seems to be the big draw at present. They must be sick of doing those same songs over and over again, but more often than not, they are great actors and put on the show that is expected. I totally respect that. When they tend to do something really creative (like Asshole by Gene Simmons or the Elder or I Was Made for Loving You in the USA), there tends to be a horrified response. Folks don't really seem to want them to be too creative, so why should they?
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Re: KISS Nostalgia Band - why?

Post by battra »

Anomaly wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 4:09 pm
battra wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 3:29 pm Bands have always made more money on tour than in the studio.

That's why Kiss spend a month (maximum) in the studio and 6 months on the road....

Kiss will always chase the easy dollar.

As I said earlier, I wish music was more important to them
Hell, there's some bands out there who have barely seen a dime from their record contracts.
Probably 95% of them honestly.
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Re: KISS Nostalgia Band - why?

Post by misterhand80 »

StillAlive wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 2:08 pm Nostalgia sells.
Look at recent setlists from other huge acts (Elton John, Billy Joel, Eagles, Fleetwood Mac, Rolling Stones, etc.).
People aren't attending for the new songs.

p.s. the record industry is a dumpster fire
In 2021 Genesis is wheeling Phil Collins on stage and he performs while seated. Genesis have not had a new album since 1997. Their last album with Phil was released in 1991 -- 30 years ago.
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Re: KISS Nostalgia Band - why?

Post by Ace of Bass »

In 1998, big money could still be made from selling records. $18 for a CD.

In 2009, KISS wanted three things: a piece of that big box store exclusive release, a crack at a #1 album, and to legitimize the lineup for a tour. The Walmart deal provided a hedge against album sales not being enough to break even on the record by effectively serving as the label and advancing KISS money via the associated merchandise marketing agreement. Sonic Boom then gave the band that last little push to get promoters to book a post-farewell arena tour. $10 for a CD.

By 2012, the industry landscape devolved even more to where the band had a legitimate chance to score that elusive #1 record without the aid of a dedicated 3rd party release partner. It also provided an opportunity to do the media circuit to promote the album and associated tour. $9 for a CD.

By 2014, it was proven that KISS could score a reasonably reliable payday as part of a co-headlining shed tour without the charade of a new record. The industry and fan base demographics had fully morphed to where purely heritage acts could make a living doing annual shed tours across the country. Some could do it on their own, maybe with a decent support act, others went the route of the 3-4 act package. CD’s are in the bargain bin behind the beaded curtain, $7 or less.

By 2021, we get vanity projects (Soul Station, The Vault), a virus that interrupts the eternal farewell tour, and Ace with a new Jag and girlfriend, but there’s at least a spectacular anniversary release coming. What’s a CD?

Fast forward to 2030 where we‘ll be complaining about holographic wigs, shabs, and scabs. We’ll be listening to music via our Bill Gates microchips.
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Re: KISS Nostalgia Band - why?

Post by strutter78 »

The band has been nostalgia based since after Revenge bombed. It took me many years to realize that the band I grew up with was no longer producing music. Trust me, if you were a fan in the 70’s and 80’s., you could almost set your watch and calendar to having a new album and tour. Eventually, I realized the Reunion was the end of the band as far as being productive musically. Sure, we've gotten a few albums since, but nothing really that competes with the output from the glory days.
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Re: KISS Nostalgia Band - why?

Post by Berninio »

Ace of Bass wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 5:10 pm In 1998, big money could still be made from selling records. $18 for a CD.

In 2009, KISS wanted three things: a piece of that big box store exclusive release, a crack at a #1 album, and to legitimize the lineup for a tour. The Walmart deal provided a hedge against album sales not being enough to break even on the record by effectively serving as the label and advancing KISS money via the associated merchandise marketing agreement. Sonic Boom then gave the band that last little push to get promoters to book a post-farewell arena tour. $10 for a CD.

By 2012, the industry landscape devolved even more to where the band had a legitimate chance to score that elusive #1 record without the aid of a dedicated 3rd party release partner. It also provided an opportunity to do the media circuit to promote the album and associated tour. $9 for a CD.

By 2014, it was proven that KISS could score a reasonably reliable payday as part of a co-headlining shed tour without the charade of a new record. The industry and fan base demographics had fully morphed to where purely heritage acts could make a living doing annual shed tours across the country. Some could do it on their own, maybe with a decent support act, others went the route of the 3-4 act package. CD’s are in the bargain bin behind the beaded curtain, $7 or less.

By 2021, we get vanity projects (Soul Station, The Vault), a virus that interrupts the eternal farewell tour, and Ace with a new Jag and girlfriend, but there’s at least a spectacular anniversary release coming. What’s a CD?

Fast forward to 2030 where we‘ll be complaining about holographic wigs, shabs, and scabs. We’ll be listening to music via our Bill Gates microchips.
Good way of looking at it. Looking forward to the holographic wigs :lol:
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Re: KISS Nostalgia Band - why?

Post by Berninio »

strutter78 wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 6:17 pm The band has been nostalgia based since after Revenge bombed. It took me many years to realize that the band I grew up with was no longer producing music. Trust me, if you were a fan in the 70’s and 80’s., you could almost set your watch and calendar to having a new album and tour. Eventually, I realized the Reunion was the end of the band as far as being productive musically. Sure, we've gotten a few albums since, but nothing really that competes with the output from the glory days.
Maybe your assessment is true regarding Revenge - never looked at it that way. What about Carnival of Souls, which I think is one of their best albums in the entire catalogue? Musically what an album - maybe pretentious, but great.

I remember the times when I would get the new record during school lunch time and showing my mates in school in the afternoon (long afternoons). The first one was The Elder, then Killers, etc.. You are right - there were so many releases - awesome times.
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Re: KISS Nostalgia Band - why?

Post by Bruce »

By Revenge, KIϟϟ was going through a lot of changes. Many of them age-related. Gene was having kids, Paul got married (!!!) and I think they just felt themselves at a crossroads between being a rock star ... and a family man. They were getting old and were being perceived that way by people buying rock music. Tastes had changed. The industry changed. And no matter what they did, how good they were, they couldn't shake the fact that KIϟϟ was either going to have to reinvent themselves, as U2 did, in a brand new way, retire ... or ... become a Nostalgia band. They did what they had to do. What they should have done. Even with their magic amulets, KIϟϟ could not stop Time. It caught up with them.
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Re: KISS Nostalgia Band - why?

Post by StillAlive »

misterhand80 wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 5:04 pm
StillAlive wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 2:08 pm Nostalgia sells.
Look at recent setlists from other huge acts (Elton John, Billy Joel, Eagles, Fleetwood Mac, Rolling Stones, etc.).
People aren't attending for the new songs.

p.s. the record industry is a dumpster fire
In 2021 Genesis is wheeling Phil Collins on stage and he performs while seated. Genesis have not had a new album since 1997. Their last album with Phil was released in 1991 -- 30 years ago.
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Re: KISS Nostalgia Band - why?

Post by Kisscandinavia »

battra wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 3:29 pm "Bands have always made more money on tour than in the studio."



Really? I think that they made more money selling albums in the 80's and touring was just a vehicle to sell more records.
For example a ticket to the LIU concert in Finland ('83) cost about $15,5 and the new album about $11 here.
I guess that their tours really didn't make much money during the 80's.
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Re: KISS Nostalgia Band - why?

Post by alivecatman »

The seeds for this were planted in the late 80s/early 90s...

1988 - KISS starts playing songs from their back catalog to the elation of fans. Remember how cool it was to hear Deuce in 1988?!? Later in 1989 Paul does the same move and plays more classics on his solo tour. I Stole Your Love?! Fuck yes!
At the same time, unofficial KISS Conventions begin sweeping the country. The Convention circuit was so popular that KISS even took notice and did their own in 95.
Once the band put the makeup back on in 96 and were an arena juggernaut again there was no going back, KISS would always be a nostalgia act regardless of new music or not.
Look at it this way, in 1995 KISS had no management and were playing actual hotel ballrooms. 1996 here comes the makeup and Doc and they sell out 4 nights at Madison Sq Garden. No brainer move.
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Re: KISS Nostalgia Band - why?

Post by Tito »

alivecatman wrote: Fri Sep 24, 2021 4:47 am Look at it this way, in 1995 KISS had no management and were playing actual hotel ballrooms. 1996 here comes the makeup and Doc and they sell out 4 nights at Madison Sq Garden. No brainer move.
Of course, but I guess what the OP was getting at was why could they not have done all that and bring out new music every now and then. Many other bands have managed to balance the two, way better than KISS anyway.
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Re: KISS Nostalgia Band - why?

Post by alivecatman »

Tito wrote: Fri Sep 24, 2021 4:56 am
alivecatman wrote: Fri Sep 24, 2021 4:47 am Look at it this way, in 1995 KISS had no management and were playing actual hotel ballrooms. 1996 here comes the makeup and Doc and they sell out 4 nights at Madison Sq Garden. No brainer move.
Of course, but I guess what the OP was getting at was why could they not have done all that and bring out new music every now and then. Many other bands have managed to balance the two, way better than KISS anyway.
Well look at it this way. 1992 KISS released Revenge the album a lot of us love and it basically went over like a fart in church. I just don't think the band sees studio output as a viable source of relevancy.

Fast forward to 1998 they tried to make Psycho Circus. We may never know what really went on with Ace and Peter but Ace was pretty messed up at that point on drugs and the on going contractual negations may have impacted the record. Again, a lot of the things we talk about surrounding this record are speculation.

But let's even take it back a step further. 1987. KISS do the right thing and bring in an outside producer and that album doesn't do what they had hoped, at least in the US. I think KISS' confidence and general want for studio material started to decline in the 80s.
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Re: KISS Nostalgia Band - why?

Post by jannep17 »

There's not enough return on investment in new music.
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Re: KISS Nostalgia Band - why?

Post by Tito »

I understand all that but it is frustrating as a fan that they do not want to make music for the sake of it. Not every album by every other band was a major success either. With this logic the last six Iron Maiden albums would not exist. Or Deep Purple albums from the '90s on.
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Re: KISS Nostalgia Band - why?

Post by Mr Slow »

Man of a Thousand Aces wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 1:55 pm I don't think it was ever 'about' the music for them. The music was a means to an end, along with everything else that went with their packaging.
This is true when you think about it. The mantra from the beginning was “we wanted to become the band we never saw”. No mention of what they were aiming for musically. The visuals were always more important. Think about it; they’ve had 2 or 3 legit hit songs and maybe 4-5 songs that people know. But pretty much everybody in the free world knows their faces.

Play a random person on the street songs like Deuce, Love Gun, Heaven’s On Fire or I Love It Loud and they’ll likely have no clue who the artist is. But show them any photo of any band member in the makeup and they’ll immediately know it’s KISS.
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Re: KISS Nostalgia Band - why?

Post by Mr Slow »

Tito wrote: Fri Sep 24, 2021 5:18 am I understand all that but it is frustrating as a fan that they do not want to make music for the sake of it. Not every album by every other band was a major success either. With this logic the last six Iron Maiden albums would not exist. Or Deep Purple albums from the '90s on.
This is where I always land too. Regardless of whether or not it went Gold (unlikely) or spawned a hit single (even less likely), it would just be nice if they were still creative and driven enough to give the fans more music. Even being conservative I think we should have had 23 studio albums by now. The 20 we got plus one around 2002/03, another in 2006/07 plus one since MONSTER.
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Re: KISS Nostalgia Band - why?

Post by battra »

Kisscandinavia wrote: Fri Sep 24, 2021 1:54 am
battra wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 3:29 pm "Bands have always made more money on tour than in the studio."

Really? I think that they made more money selling albums in the 80's and touring was just a vehicle to sell more records.
For example a ticket to the LIU concert in Finland ('83) cost about $15,5 and the new album about $11 here.
I guess that their tours really didn't make much money during the 80's.
The artist makes about 10% of the price of an album sale AFTER they pay back the record company.

On tour, the band keeps the lions share of the money.
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Re: KISS Nostalgia Band - why?

Post by Anomaly »

Plus, consider back then the record companies didn't touch the tour proceeds. Nowadays with the advent of 360 deals, the labels want a major cut of touring revenue as well to make up for the loss of income from album/single sales.
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Re: KISS Nostalgia Band - why?

Post by KingOfHearts89 »

2004 - Gene Simmons asshole
2006 - Paul Stanleys Live to Win
2009 - Sonic Boom
2012 - Monster
2015 - Album with Japanese group
2017 - Gene Simmons Vault
2021 - Paul Stanley's Soul Station

Gene & Paul still being creative, I think their solo stuff shows that they're burned out with writing KISS like material.
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Re: KISS Nostalgia Band - why?

Post by Going Blind »

misterhand80 wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 5:04 pm
StillAlive wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 2:08 pm Nostalgia sells.
Look at recent setlists from other huge acts (Elton John, Billy Joel, Eagles, Fleetwood Mac, Rolling Stones, etc.).
People aren't attending for the new songs.

p.s. the record industry is a dumpster fire
In 2021 Genesis is wheeling Phil Collins on stage and he performs while seated. Genesis have not had a new album since 1997. Their last album with Phil was released in 1991 -- 30 years ago.
Would be great to put Pete back in front, and Phil behind the drums. Put some crazy costume on Pete and it would be magic. But I have to assume Phil cannot even play the drums at this point.
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Re: KISS Nostalgia Band - why?

Post by nibbler1982 »

StillAlive wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 11:53 pm
misterhand80 wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 5:04 pm
StillAlive wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 2:08 pm Nostalgia sells.
Look at recent setlists from other huge acts (Elton John, Billy Joel, Eagles, Fleetwood Mac, Rolling Stones, etc.).
People aren't attending for the new songs.

p.s. the record industry is a dumpster fire
In 2021 Genesis is wheeling Phil Collins on stage and he performs while seated. Genesis have not had a new album since 1997. Their last album with Phil was released in 1991 -- 30 years ago.
Image
And it doesn’t matter, not even a little bit.

Monday 20th September Birmingham Utilita Arena
Tuesday 21st September Birmingham Utilita Arena
Wednesday 22nd September Birmingham Utilita Arena
Friday 24th September Manchester AO Arena
Saturday 25th September Manchester AO Arena
Monday 27th September Leeds First Direct Arena
Tuesday 28th September Leeds First Direct Arena
Thursday 30th September Newcastle Utilita Arena
Friday 1st October Newcastle Utilita Arena
Sunday 3rd October Liverpool M & S Bank Arena
Monday 4th October Liverpool M & S Bank Arena
Thursday 7th October Glasgow The SSE Hydro
Friday 8th October Glasgow The SSE Hydro
Monday 11th October London O2
Tuesday 12th October London O2
Wednesday 13th October London O2

I got my tickets to UBS and MSG.
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Re: KISS Nostalgia Band - why?

Post by nibbler1982 »

Going Blind wrote: Fri Sep 24, 2021 8:22 am
misterhand80 wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 5:04 pm
StillAlive wrote: Thu Sep 23, 2021 2:08 pm Nostalgia sells.
Look at recent setlists from other huge acts (Elton John, Billy Joel, Eagles, Fleetwood Mac, Rolling Stones, etc.).
People aren't attending for the new songs.

p.s. the record industry is a dumpster fire
In 2021 Genesis is wheeling Phil Collins on stage and he performs while seated. Genesis have not had a new album since 1997. Their last album with Phil was released in 1991 -- 30 years ago.
Would be great to put Pete back in front, and Phil behind the drums. Put some crazy costume on Pete and it would be magic. But I have to assume Phil cannot even play the drums at this point.
He can’t. He hasn’t been able to for many years.

Love Pete. And I love your scenario. As long as the set list is laden Peter Gabriel Genesis songs. If it is that WILL NOT go over with the paying consumers. If you want to hear those songs just go see Steve Hackett’s “Genesis Revisited” show at a theater near you. To me, When The Heart Rules The Mind is worth the price of admission alone.