ALL SYSTEMS GO "would have easily done 3 MILLION'

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ALL SYSTEMS GO "would have easily done 3 MILLION'

Post by Doose »

.
I found this interesting with a lot of "what ifs" and "if onlys." Definitely sounds like it was written by Vinnie. A few points caught my eye:
  • Did Vinnie have a blowout with David Snowden? I had never heard that.
  • The idea that Vinnie was "all set to tour, planning out music videos, you name it..." Laughable at best, since Vinnie has NEVER been able to do a single thing on his own.
  • The idea that Chrysalis was to blame for ASG not "easily" selling 3 million.


Re: What if Vinnie Vincent Invasion had continued?
Post by VVArchives » Sun Sep 19, 2021 4:59 am

Genebaby wrote: ↑Sat Jul 31, 2021 8:50 am
If Vinnie was more normal and a team player as you say then hopefully the second album would have built more good momentum during the touring and promotion phase instead of disintegration.

This would have set the scene for the third ablum to be quite successful, until the Grunge movement hit.

That might have been a problem, but it does depend on the band wether they might have been dropped, which did happen.

Still, the Vinnie we are talking about here, would have pulled himself up by his bootstraps and gotten on with things another way if need be, so there is so much possibility.


I disagree completely. You are talking about 3 different heads at Chrysalis when Vinnie was there.

Why not blame Vinnie's incompetent manager for lying to Chrysalis that Robert was signed? Look at the problems that lie caused.

Look how hugely successful "Vinnie Vincent Invasion" debut was. A huge 29 weeks on BIllboards charts with only 1 single/video. KISS was lucky to stay on 29 weeks with 3 singles & videos. Vinnie was kicking their butt. 23 of those weeks was in the Top 90 on Billboard.

After that huge success, in come new people to screw things up.

Who wasn't a Team Player?

Why not ask, what would have happened if ASG came out when it was scheduled to originally? None of the "meltdown" would have happened.

Ashes To Ashes would have been the lead off single/video (beating Kingdom Come's "Get It On").

Vinnie wouldn't have had all that down time to go through auditioning 50 managers to replace Sewitt.

Vinnie would have been opening for Aerosmith "Permanent Vacation"

Instead, what happened? They lost major opening spot with Aerosmith.

"Get It On" blew up on MTV and "Ashes" got pushed aside

All that down time lead to infighting etc. It also lead to the label getting Mark/Dana to go behind Vinnie's back and stab him. Dana is a POS who edited out solos behind Vinnie's back as he was a lapdog for the label at that point. Talk about non-team players.

And the label screwed up one thing after another.

ASG ccme out in May, but you didn't see "That Time Of Year" come out until 2nd week of July.

Then TTOY didn't get any momentum because it was soon replaced by "Love Kills". Because that had to come out when it did because of the movie promotion.

Of course, David Snowden lied about acting like he saw the video play on their bus which was bs. David had already been banned since early July. At at that point, it didn't matter what the video said, because Vinnie had already had it out with them in July wanting out.

And Chrysalis was about bankrupt by the time Vinnie left. Certainly did get lucky Chyrsalis was bought before their debut came out. And they could spend a fortune helping "break them" with VVI fans help.

Some act like it was odd, Vinnie tried to get Chrysalis to sign him again after he had left, but that was with the new team who came in after they were bought out.

Who knows what would have happened if Enigma didn't run out of money. Vinnie was all set to tour, he was planning out music videos. You name it. That lineup would have been far stronger than the VVI lineup.

And that album certainly is Vinnie's strongest album. And it doesn't show the juvenile production Dana brought to ASG.

And sure Slaughter had a good run with 1 album beneffiting from the Vinnie Vincent years and all the hype. And of course, being on the KISS tour before all those VV fans sure helped as well.

But the Wild Life was a huge drop in sales. 3M to 650K or so. And they were soon dropped by Chrysalis.

I do think if Chrysalis had not screwed up ASG like they did, it would have easily done 3M+
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Re: ALL SYSTEMS GO "would have easily done 3 MILLION'

Post by battra »

Here for the comments.
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Re: ALL SYSTEMS GO "would have easily done 3 MILLION'

Post by TheSpoiler »

My head hurts.
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Re: ALL SYSTEMS GO "would have easily done 3 MILLION'

Post by TheKISSProject7312 »

Doose wrote: Sun Sep 19, 2021 1:12 pm
If Vinnie was more normal
That's a hell of an "if."
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Re: ALL SYSTEMS GO "would have easily done 3 MILLION'

Post by Tito »

TLDR.
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Re: ALL SYSTEMS GO "would have easily done 3 MILLION'

Post by misterhand80 »

What is this we are reading? Why is it in the same style as The Sphynx's writing?
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Re: ALL SYSTEMS GO "would have easily done 3 MILLION'

Post by stutterer »

Man how you refrained from laying it all out to Paul about Vinnie, I'll never know.
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Re: ALL SYSTEMS GO "would have easily done 3 MILLION'

Post by Den Dennis »

No, they were B level at best.
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Re: ALL SYSTEMS GO "would have easily done 3 MILLION'

Post by Kissoff »

Interesting.
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Re: ALL SYSTEMS GO "would have easily done 3 MILLION'

Post by Anomaly »

Same doofus who made those points kept pointing out how supposedly huge of a video Love Kills was on MTV. The spin he then made when the video wasn't on MTV's Top-100 Most Played Videos of 1988 was insane. :lol:
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Re: ALL SYSTEMS GO "would have easily done 3 MILLION'

Post by Tommyr »

I like cake.
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Re: ALL SYSTEMS GO "would have easily done 3 MILLION'

Post by battra »

Tito wrote: Sun Sep 19, 2021 2:12 pmTLDR.
I read every, single, unhinged word.

It was crazier than my mother in law vacuuming the basement yesterday.
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Re: ALL SYSTEMS GO "would have easily done 3 MILLION'

Post by battra »

Anomaly wrote: Sun Sep 19, 2021 2:48 pm Same doofus who made those points kept pointing out how supposedly huge of a video Love Kills was on MTV. The spin he then made when the video wasn't on MTV's Top-100 Most Played Videos of 1988 was insane. :lol:
In 1987 I watched two things, wrestling and MTV.

I ain't never seen that video till coming here in like 2014.
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Re: ALL SYSTEMS GO "would have easily done 3 MILLION'

Post by Starchild74 »

Anomaly wrote: Sun Sep 19, 2021 2:48 pm Same doofus who made those points kept pointing out how supposedly huge of a video Love Kills was on MTV. The spin he then made when the video wasn't on MTV's Top-100 Most Played Videos of 1988 was insane. :lol:

How many videos did Kiss put out that made the year end Top 100? I could only find Forever. So is that a good judge of things?

I thought Paul's great song Tears Are Falling ruled on Dial-Mtv but I couldn't find it on
Their year end . 85 or 86 .
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Re: ALL SYSTEMS GO "would have easily done 3 MILLION'

Post by Mahatma »

TheKISSProject7312 wrote: Sun Sep 19, 2021 2:06 pm
Doose wrote: Sun Sep 19, 2021 1:12 pm
If Vinnie was more normal
That's a hell of an "if."
:lol: :lol: :lol:
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Re: ALL SYSTEMS GO "would have easily done 3 MILLION'

Post by Anomaly »

Starchild74 wrote: Sun Sep 19, 2021 3:22 pm
Anomaly wrote: Sun Sep 19, 2021 2:48 pm Same doofus who made those points kept pointing out how supposedly huge of a video Love Kills was on MTV. The spin he then made when the video wasn't on MTV's Top-100 Most Played Videos of 1988 was insane. :lol:

How many videos did Kiss put out that made the year end Top 100? I could only find Forever. So is that a good judge of things?

I thought Paul's great song Tears Are Falling ruled on Dial-Mtv but I couldn't find it on
Their year end . 85 or 86 .
The difference is I don't think anybody on here was ever making the case for a non-makeup KISS video being a humongous smash hit on MTV.
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Re: ALL SYSTEMS GO "would have easily done 3 MILLION'

Post by Phyllis Simmons »

Looks like you've cut and pasted some of Sphinxie's old posts.
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Re: ALL SYSTEMS GO "would have easily done 3 MILLION'

Post by Eddie Van Hazel »

"Love Kills" and "That Time Of Year" got decent video play on MTV's Headbanger's Ball, but that's about it.

The thing that stood out to me were the video credits: "Vinnie Vincent Invasion FEATURING Mark Slaughter".
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Re: ALL SYSTEMS GO "would have easily done 3 MILLION'

Post by Statuegirl21 »

ablum
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Re: ALL SYSTEMS GO "would have easily done 3 MILLION'

Post by Bruce »

battra wrote: Sun Sep 19, 2021 3:10 pm I read every, single, unhinged word.
"Unhinged"!! Haha ... quite so.
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Re: ALL SYSTEMS GO "would have easily done 3 MILLION'

Post by LoveGun77 »

I'm calling bullshit on 3 million copies. No f'n way. His solo band was never that big. I don't believe for a second. No way it was gonna do that.
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Re: ALL SYSTEMS GO "would have easily done 3 MILLION'

Post by So Cruel »

3m? 3M? In their fucking dreams. 3m divided by 10 maybe.
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Re: ALL SYSTEMS GO "would have easily done 3 MILLION'

Post by Ratmir »

He meant 3 billion
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Re: ALL SYSTEMS GO "would have easily done 3 MILLION'

Post by Vinniefan123 »

Yes that writing style and the spiteful venom towards the other band members sounds suspicious. As with many other people before and after him, there was a falling out with David Snowden. There’s a video on YouTube about it. David was interviewed and described being invited to dinner with Vinnie and his family, being strongly praised by him, and then suddenly, for no real reason, shunned and ignored
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Re: ALL SYSTEMS GO "would have easily done 3 MILLION'

Post by Tito »

misterhand80 wrote: Sun Sep 19, 2021 2:15 pm What is this we are reading? Why is it in the same style as The Sphynx's writing?
If it looks like a duck...
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Re: ALL SYSTEMS GO "would have easily done 3 MILLION'

Post by gene therapist »

I cursorily read through the opening and my eyes picked "Who wasn't a Team Player?". I think that is a question we all know the answer to. There's no I in TEAM but I's beat E's 2-1 in VINNIE.
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Re: ALL SYSTEMS GO "would have easily done 3 MILLION'

Post by steve »

Terrible album. Weak as water production and damned near unlistenable vocals. I'd be surprised if it sold 300.

VVI, tuneless and overdone as it was, at least had some good ideas under all the noise and showboating. ASG can make no such claim.
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Re: ALL SYSTEMS GO "would have easily done 3 MILLION'

Post by Coventry1973 »

Vinniefan123 wrote: Sun Sep 19, 2021 8:13 pm Yes that writing style and the spiteful venom towards the other band members sounds suspicious. As with many other people before and after him, there was a falling out with David Snowden. There’s a video on YouTube about it. David was interviewed and described being invited to dinner with Vinnie and his family, being strongly praised by him, and then suddenly, for no real reason, shunned and ignored
David Snowden is a really good guy.
Vinnie has people and then throws them away when new people come in and have his ear. Look what happened to his guitar guy that had been with him for the last 20 years before all the Vinnie Vincent is back nonsense. Totally left the guy for new people, even though (can't remember his name) had been there with Vinnie throughout all this time. Shame :cry:
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Re: ALL SYSTEMS GO "would have easily done 3 MILLION'

Post by redinthesky »

It's so funny, often we hear about how "successful" VVI was, but I hung out with a metal crowd then, and absolutely no one gave one darn about Vinnie Vincent. I do remember the girls loved Mark Slaughter though.

On a related note, I just read the book "Raising Hell: Backstage Tales from the Lives of Metal Legends" with stories from tons of musicians. Mark Slaughter says this about opening for Maiden ---

Image
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Re: ALL SYSTEMS GO "would have easily done 3 MILLION'

Post by Doose »

Coventry1973 wrote: Mon Sep 20, 2021 7:57 am
Vinniefan123 wrote: Sun Sep 19, 2021 8:13 pm Yes that writing style and the spiteful venom towards the other band members sounds suspicious. As with many other people before and after him, there was a falling out with David Snowden. There’s a video on YouTube about it. David was interviewed and described being invited to dinner with Vinnie and his family, being strongly praised by him, and then suddenly, for no real reason, shunned and ignored
David Snowden is a really good guy.
Vinnie has people and then throws them away when new people come in and have his ear. Look what happened to his guitar guy that had been with him for the last 20 years before all the Vinnie Vincent is back nonsense. Totally left the guy for new people, even though (can't remember his name) had been there with Vinnie throughout all this time. Shame :cry:
Vinnie had so much promise coming out of Atlanta, then dumped everyone that made that happen. He went through a string of losers who then gave him bad advice - horror conventions, etc. We're approaching 4 years since Atlanta, and not a single new song, not a single new CD, not a single real show. Vinnie has well proven that the biggest problem with Vinnie Vincent is Vinnie Vincent.
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Re: ALL SYSTEMS GO "would have easily done 3 MILLION'

Post by battra »

Just a reminder, we did All Systems Go on the DMA podcast

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Re: ALL SYSTEMS GO "would have easily done 3 MILLION'

Post by Anomaly »

Doose wrote: Mon Sep 20, 2021 10:56 am
Coventry1973 wrote: Mon Sep 20, 2021 7:57 am
Vinniefan123 wrote: Sun Sep 19, 2021 8:13 pm Yes that writing style and the spiteful venom towards the other band members sounds suspicious. As with many other people before and after him, there was a falling out with David Snowden. There’s a video on YouTube about it. David was interviewed and described being invited to dinner with Vinnie and his family, being strongly praised by him, and then suddenly, for no real reason, shunned and ignored
David Snowden is a really good guy.
Vinnie has people and then throws them away when new people come in and have his ear. Look what happened to his guitar guy that had been with him for the last 20 years before all the Vinnie Vincent is back nonsense. Totally left the guy for new people, even though (can't remember his name) had been there with Vinnie throughout all this time. Shame :cry:
Vinnie had so much promise coming out of Atlanta, then dumped everyone that made that happen. He went through a string of losers who then gave him bad advice - horror conventions, etc. We're approaching 4 years since Atlanta, and not a single new song, not a single new CD, not a single real show. Vinnie has well proven that the biggest problem with Vinnie Vincent is Vinnie Vincent.
In all honesty, the horror convention route probably was the better route.
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Re: ALL SYSTEMS GO "would have easily done 3 MILLION'

Post by Doose »

Anomaly wrote: Mon Sep 20, 2021 12:19 pm
Doose wrote: Mon Sep 20, 2021 10:56 am
Coventry1973 wrote: Mon Sep 20, 2021 7:57 am
Vinniefan123 wrote: Sun Sep 19, 2021 8:13 pm Yes that writing style and the spiteful venom towards the other band members sounds suspicious. As with many other people before and after him, there was a falling out with David Snowden. There’s a video on YouTube about it. David was interviewed and described being invited to dinner with Vinnie and his family, being strongly praised by him, and then suddenly, for no real reason, shunned and ignored
David Snowden is a really good guy.
Vinnie has people and then throws them away when new people come in and have his ear. Look what happened to his guitar guy that had been with him for the last 20 years before all the Vinnie Vincent is back nonsense. Totally left the guy for new people, even though (can't remember his name) had been there with Vinnie throughout all this time. Shame :cry:
Vinnie had so much promise coming out of Atlanta, then dumped everyone that made that happen. He went through a string of losers who then gave him bad advice - horror conventions, etc. We're approaching 4 years since Atlanta, and not a single new song, not a single new CD, not a single real show. Vinnie has well proven that the biggest problem with Vinnie Vincent is Vinnie Vincent.
In all honesty, the horror convention route probably was the better route.
The best route, imo, would have been to play with Carmine Appice and Tony Franklin. Vinnie burned out on the horror convention circuit after 2 or 3 appearances, because there was nothing new to support. I remember the reports that came out of him were embarrassing - being difficult, being placed near the bathrooms, having only 15-20 people show up. Being in KISS for 18 months some forty+ years ago can only be milked for so long. Playing with Appice and Franklin could have opened up so many new possibilities.
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Re: ALL SYSTEMS GO "would have easily done 3 MILLION'

Post by Stlouisblue »

If only they had gotten Tommy to manage the band...
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Re: ALL SYSTEMS GO "would have easily done 3 MILLION'

Post by EasyCatMan »

Vinnie probably would have done something to screw it up even under the best circumstances, but is it as out of the realm as some act?

Stick It To Ya did 3M. Why couldn't ASG? I think ASG is a better album and had far better potential singles than SITY.

Anyone know what Aerosmith averaged on that tour? I've seen some tour dates and while Aerosmith was doing 15K or so a night, KISS was doing about 5K a night (on Crazy Nights) while Permanent tour was going on / 6K a night Hot In The Shade.

So would VVI have benefited more from the far larger crowds or did Slaughter benefit from being on a smaller tour but where they already had a huge KISS connection and following?

Would "Ashes" have been embraced at radio like "Get It On" if released before it? That's a $100 question. Billboard's review basically called the album a Zep tribute album and they mentioned it shipped 500,000 to begin with. So obviously alot of eager Zepplin fans ate it up. Would they have eaten up "Ashes To Ashes"?

If Ashes had been released in December and followed up by That Time Of Year in April and then Love Kills at the beginning of August (with movie tie in), while touring with Aerosmith. How big could that album of become? Slaughter was at 2M after about 16 months after release.

Of course, Vinnie probably would have gotten into it with Joe Perry and gotten kicked off the tour or something crazy.

Was "Love Kills" a hit video on MTV? Not when it was only in medium rotation.
Was it a hit on Dial-MT? That would be debatable. One could certainly say it was. Being in the countdown for weeks and going Number 1 on it several times.

One does wonder how much the label pushed it at that point since they knew it was all over.

I do wonder how someone can claim they were watching MTV all the time and they never saw a video that was in Medium rotation, on Headbangers etc.


The Maiden story someone told was confirmed by Bobby. Bobby mentioned Iron Maiden fans calling them the homophobic F word and getting hit with a bottle. And how they quickly toned down the glam. I wouldn't be surprised with them starting out in Texas for 3 shows and that happening.


That was a great time period. New music from Kiss, Ace, Vinnie, Mark. If we would only have gotten a Balls Of Fire live album even.
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Re: ALL SYSTEMS GO "would have easily done 3 MILLION'

Post by EasyCatMan »

Doose wrote: Mon Sep 20, 2021 12:58 pm
Anomaly wrote: Mon Sep 20, 2021 12:19 pm
Doose wrote: Mon Sep 20, 2021 10:56 am
Coventry1973 wrote: Mon Sep 20, 2021 7:57 am

David Snowden is a really good guy.
Vinnie has people and then throws them away when new people come in and have his ear. Look what happened to his guitar guy that had been with him for the last 20 years before all the Vinnie Vincent is back nonsense. Totally left the guy for new people, even though (can't remember his name) had been there with Vinnie throughout all this time. Shame :cry:
Vinnie had so much promise coming out of Atlanta, then dumped everyone that made that happen. He went through a string of losers who then gave him bad advice - horror conventions, etc. We're approaching 4 years since Atlanta, and not a single new song, not a single new CD, not a single real show. Vinnie has well proven that the biggest problem with Vinnie Vincent is Vinnie Vincent.
In all honesty, the horror convention route probably was the better route.
The best route, imo, would have been to play with Carmine Appice and Tony Franklin. Vinnie burned out on the horror convention circuit after 2 or 3 appearances, because there was nothing new to support. I remember the reports that came out of him were embarrassing - being difficult, being placed near the bathrooms, having only 15-20 people show up. Being in KISS for 18 months some forty+ years ago can only be milked for so long. Playing with Appice and Franklin could have opened up so many new possibilities.

But people bought posters to a non-existent show. How crazy is that?!

I still can't believe Robert flipped out so much because he wasn't on the poster. He kinda acts like he was Steve Perry in Journey instead of what he really was.

He shows up at horror conventions because a song of his was used in A Nightmare On Elm Street 4?

Does he go to surf conventions because a song off the debut was cranked up in Summer School?
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Re: ALL SYSTEMS GO "would have easily done 3 MILLION'

Post by Hotter Than Heck »

Kiss has never even received a triple platinum sales certification so All Systems Go would have easily done 3 million

It's an interesting take, for sure
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Re: ALL SYSTEMS GO "would have easily done 3 MILLION'

Post by battra »

Hotter Than Heck wrote: Mon Sep 20, 2021 4:15 pm Kiss has never even received a triple platinum sales certification so All Systems Go would have easily done 3 million

It's an interesting take, for sure
That any of the songs on this musical abortion could be a hit is also an interesting take.

Top to bottom, All Systems Go, is worthless.
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Re: ALL SYSTEMS GO "would have easily done 3 MILLION'

Post by Statuegirl21 »

They’re not exclusively horror conventions. Peter Criss has done them.
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Re: ALL SYSTEMS GO "would have easily done 3 MILLION'

Post by gothunder »

Well whatever, really like this album.
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Re: ALL SYSTEMS GO "would have easily done 3 MILLION'

Post by Nately120 »

battra wrote: Sun Sep 19, 2021 3:13 pm
Anomaly wrote: Sun Sep 19, 2021 2:48 pm Same doofus who made those points kept pointing out how supposedly huge of a video Love Kills was on MTV. The spin he then made when the video wasn't on MTV's Top-100 Most Played Videos of 1988 was insane. :lol:
In 1987 I watched two things, wrestling and MTV.

I ain't never seen that video till coming here in like 2014.
I saw Uncle Elmer sing "Walk Through This World With Me" before I saw "Love Kills."
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Re: ALL SYSTEMS GO "would have easily done 3 MILLION'

Post by Hotter Than Heck »

gothunder wrote: Mon Sep 20, 2021 4:18 pm Well whatever, really like this album.
I can hear some great stuff on this & also on the debut

Some of the arrangements just seem too...busy, like the songs aren't allowed to breathe

But there's lots of quality rock & pop riffs & melodies. The potential is obvious on lots of the tracks from both LPs

These aren't among the favorite albums I own but I do own both of them & I think they're alright musically but especially I think both Vin's LPS are perfect time capsules for that late 80s mainstream hard rock vibe that was going on at the time
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Re: ALL SYSTEMS GO "would have easily done 3 MILLION'

Post by gothunder »

Hotter Than Heck wrote: Mon Sep 20, 2021 4:48 pm
gothunder wrote: Mon Sep 20, 2021 4:18 pm Well whatever, really like this album.
I can hear some great stuff on this & also on the debut

Some of the arrangements just seem too...busy, like the songs aren't allowed to breathe

But there's lots of quality rock & pop riffs & melodies. The potential is obvious on lots of the tracks from both LPs

These aren't among the favorite albums I own but I do own both of them & I think they're alright musically but especially I think both Vin's LPS are perfect time capsules for that late 80s mainstream hard rock vibe that was going on at the time
:D
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Re: ALL SYSTEMS GO "would have easily done 3 MILLION'

Post by DOUBLE DYNASTY »

Doose wrote: Sun Sep 19, 2021 1:12 pm .
I found this interesting with a lot of "what ifs" and "if onlys." Definitely sounds like it was written by Vinnie. A few points caught my eye:
  • Did Vinnie have a blowout with David Snowden? I had never heard that.
  • The idea that Vinnie was "all set to tour, planning out music videos, you name it..." Laughable at best, since Vinnie has NEVER been able to do a single thing on his own.
  • The idea that Chrysalis was to blame for ASG not "easily" selling 3 million.


Re: What if Vinnie Vincent Invasion had continued?
Post by VVArchives » Sun Sep 19, 2021 4:59 am

Genebaby wrote: ↑Sat Jul 31, 2021 8:50 am
If Vinnie was more normal and a team player as you say then hopefully the second album would have built more good momentum during the touring and promotion phase instead of disintegration.

This would have set the scene for the third ablum to be quite successful, until the Grunge movement hit.

That might have been a problem, but it does depend on the band wether they might have been dropped, which did happen.

Still, the Vinnie we are talking about here, would have pulled himself up by his bootstraps and gotten on with things another way if need be, so there is so much possibility.


I disagree completely. You are talking about 3 different heads at Chrysalis when Vinnie was there.

Why not blame Vinnie's incompetent manager for lying to Chrysalis that Robert was signed? Look at the problems that lie caused.

Look how hugely successful "Vinnie Vincent Invasion" debut was. A huge 29 weeks on BIllboards charts with only 1 single/video. KISS was lucky to stay on 29 weeks with 3 singles & videos. Vinnie was kicking their butt. 23 of those weeks was in the Top 90 on Billboard.

After that huge success, in come new people to screw things up.

Who wasn't a Team Player?

Why not ask, what would have happened if ASG came out when it was scheduled to originally? None of the "meltdown" would have happened.

Ashes To Ashes would have been the lead off single/video (beating Kingdom Come's "Get It On").

Vinnie wouldn't have had all that down time to go through auditioning 50 managers to replace Sewitt.

Vinnie would have been opening for Aerosmith "Permanent Vacation"

Instead, what happened? They lost major opening spot with Aerosmith.

"Get It On" blew up on MTV and "Ashes" got pushed aside

All that down time lead to infighting etc. It also lead to the label getting Mark/Dana to go behind Vinnie's back and stab him. Dana is a POS who edited out solos behind Vinnie's back as he was a lapdog for the label at that point. Talk about non-team players.

And the label screwed up one thing after another.

ASG ccme out in May, but you didn't see "That Time Of Year" come out until 2nd week of July.

Then TTOY didn't get any momentum because it was soon replaced by "Love Kills". Because that had to come out when it did because of the movie promotion.

Of course, David Snowden lied about acting like he saw the video play on their bus which was bs. David had already been banned since early July. At at that point, it didn't matter what the video said, because Vinnie had already had it out with them in July wanting out.

And Chrysalis was about bankrupt by the time Vinnie left. Certainly did get lucky Chyrsalis was bought before their debut came out. And they could spend a fortune helping "break them" with VVI fans help.

Some act like it was odd, Vinnie tried to get Chrysalis to sign him again after he had left, but that was with the new team who came in after they were bought out.

Who knows what would have happened if Enigma didn't run out of money. Vinnie was all set to tour, he was planning out music videos. You name it. That lineup would have been far stronger than the VVI lineup.

And that album certainly is Vinnie's strongest album. And it doesn't show the juvenile production Dana brought to ASG.

And sure Slaughter had a good run with 1 album beneffiting from the Vinnie Vincent years and all the hype. And of course, being on the KISS tour before all those VV fans sure helped as well.

But the Wild Life was a huge drop in sales. 3M to 650K or so. And they were soon dropped by Chrysalis.

I do think if Chrysalis had not screwed up ASG like they did, it would have easily done 3M+
There is one single person who's shoulders all of this falls on. The rest is just a bunch of "stories" and "excuses" and other such nonsense.
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Re: ALL SYSTEMS GO "would have easily done 3 MILLION'

Post by shandi777 »

IF....says it all.
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Re: ALL SYSTEMS GO "would have easily done 3 MILLION'

Post by Tito »

Doose wrote: Mon Sep 20, 2021 12:58 pm I remember the reports that came out of him were embarrassing - being difficult, being placed near the bathrooms, having only 15-20 people show up.
But 3 million people could have showed up, easily.
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Re: ALL SYSTEMS GO "would have easily done 3 MILLION'

Post by Frehley's Vomit »

Doose wrote: Sun Sep 19, 2021 1:12 pm .
I found this interesting with a lot of "what ifs" and "if onlys." Definitely sounds like it was written by Vinnie. A few points caught my eye:
  • Did Vinnie have a blowout with David Snowden? I had never heard that.
  • The idea that Vinnie was "all set to tour, planning out music videos, you name it..." Laughable at best, since Vinnie has NEVER been able to do a single thing on his own.
  • The idea that Chrysalis was to blame for ASG not "easily" selling 3 million.


Re: What if Vinnie Vincent Invasion had continued?
Post by VVArchives » Sun Sep 19, 2021 4:59 am

Genebaby wrote: ↑Sat Jul 31, 2021 8:50 am
If Vinnie was more normal and a team player as you say then hopefully the second album would have built more good momentum during the touring and promotion phase instead of disintegration.

This would have set the scene for the third ablum to be quite successful, until the Grunge movement hit.

That might have been a problem, but it does depend on the band wether they might have been dropped, which did happen.

Still, the Vinnie we are talking about here, would have pulled himself up by his bootstraps and gotten on with things another way if need be, so there is so much possibility.


I disagree completely. You are talking about 3 different heads at Chrysalis when Vinnie was there.

Why not blame Vinnie's incompetent manager for lying to Chrysalis that Robert was signed? Look at the problems that lie caused.

Look how hugely successful "Vinnie Vincent Invasion" debut was. A huge 29 weeks on BIllboards charts with only 1 single/video. KISS was lucky to stay on 29 weeks with 3 singles & videos. Vinnie was kicking their butt. 23 of those weeks was in the Top 90 on Billboard.

After that huge success, in come new people to screw things up.

Who wasn't a Team Player?

Why not ask, what would have happened if ASG came out when it was scheduled to originally? None of the "meltdown" would have happened.

Ashes To Ashes would have been the lead off single/video (beating Kingdom Come's "Get It On").

Vinnie wouldn't have had all that down time to go through auditioning 50 managers to replace Sewitt.

Vinnie would have been opening for Aerosmith "Permanent Vacation"

Instead, what happened? They lost major opening spot with Aerosmith.

"Get It On" blew up on MTV and "Ashes" got pushed aside

All that down time lead to infighting etc. It also lead to the label getting Mark/Dana to go behind Vinnie's back and stab him. Dana is a POS who edited out solos behind Vinnie's back as he was a lapdog for the label at that point. Talk about non-team players.

And the label screwed up one thing after another.

ASG ccme out in May, but you didn't see "That Time Of Year" come out until 2nd week of July.

Then TTOY didn't get any momentum because it was soon replaced by "Love Kills". Because that had to come out when it did because of the movie promotion.

Of course, David Snowden lied about acting like he saw the video play on their bus which was bs. David had already been banned since early July. At at that point, it didn't matter what the video said, because Vinnie had already had it out with them in July wanting out.

And Chrysalis was about bankrupt by the time Vinnie left. Certainly did get lucky Chyrsalis was bought before their debut came out. And they could spend a fortune helping "break them" with VVI fans help.

Some act like it was odd, Vinnie tried to get Chrysalis to sign him again after he had left, but that was with the new team who came in after they were bought out.

Who knows what would have happened if Enigma didn't run out of money. Vinnie was all set to tour, he was planning out music videos. You name it. That lineup would have been far stronger than the VVI lineup.

And that album certainly is Vinnie's strongest album. And it doesn't show the juvenile production Dana brought to ASG.

And sure Slaughter had a good run with 1 album beneffiting from the Vinnie Vincent years and all the hype. And of course, being on the KISS tour before all those VV fans sure helped as well.

But the Wild Life was a huge drop in sales. 3M to 650K or so. And they were soon dropped by Chrysalis.

I do think if Chrysalis had not screwed up ASG like they did, it would have easily done 3M+
Gee, where have we heard this crock of shit before, pretty much word for word? :lol:
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Re: ALL SYSTEMS GO "would have easily done 3 MILLION'

Post by Nately120 »

ASG did 500k but it would have done 3 million if the guy who hasn't made an album in 33 years would have had more control over it. Lordy loo, what a stretch.

I'm sure in some parallel dimension Vinnie took total control of VVI and neither album was released and the 20 songs are forever promised to be on his box set in addition to everything else that he's "wisely" kept out of the hands of any dastardly bandmate or record label.
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Re: ALL SYSTEMS GO "would have easily done 3 MILLION'

Post by Pollux »

I dig this album a lot. Had it been, say, a follow up for Lick It Up it could have sold more than 3M.
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Re: ALL SYSTEMS GO "would have easily done 3 MILLION'

Post by Doose »

Neither the debut album or ASG were EVER going to have enough mainstream appeal to sell anywhere close to a million, let alone 3 million.

Vinnie never even sold enough copies of BOTH albums to cover his advance of a few hundred grand. In his bankruptcy proceedings, he said he never made a dime on royalties because the record company never recouped their expenses.