Who was Hotter Than Hell first?

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Who was Hotter Than Hell first?

Post by StarChild1978 »

An interesting observation: I own this original Styx promo poster but it doesn’t have a date printed on it. I’ve seen two sources stating it is from 1972. If so, it predates KISS’ HTH album by a couple of years. Styx was off the Wooden Nickel label by the end of 1974 so even if it was printed later it was still in the same general time as the HTH release. The similarities are interesting to me to say the least.

Has anyone else ever seen or noticed this?
86EA09F6-5BE7-4BB4-9872-EB22645164E6.jpeg
75CCE7C2-AD8D-4C64-BD48-854DE85CCB24.jpeg
BFD3C02E-19F2-4CED-90B0-072986848766.jpeg
C9801305-4169-4251-BA60-DE4A6AA7184D.jpeg
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Re: Who was Hotter Than Hell first?

Post by caligari »

1972?
The “winner” is STYX.
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Re: Who was Hotter Than Hell first?

Post by Frigoria »

Zeitgeist.
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Re: Who was Hotter Than Hell first?

Post by Goodwilltowardsall »

This is shocking,
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Re: Who was Hotter Than Hell first?

Post by Kissoff »

Just Wow
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Re: Who was Hotter Than Hell first?

Post by TheKISSProject7312 »

It's sad. The longer you stay a KISS fan, the more you start to realise that they've never had an original idea in their lives.

My user name refers to my website where I review every single song recorded by the band. I never really realised it before, but the amount of KISS songs that completely and blatantly steal from other songs by other bands is absolutely shocking.
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Re: Who was Hotter Than Hell first?

Post by THUNDERKISS66 »

Just to-be-clear. No band or musician has had an original idea. Every single musician or band as BORROWED some idea or song from people or persons'. To say KISS has not had an original idea is irrelevant. All musicians are influenced by something.
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Re: Who was Hotter Than Hell first?

Post by TheKISSProject7312 »

THUNDERKISS66 wrote: Tue Sep 14, 2021 4:37 pm Just to-be-clear. No band or musician has had an original idea. Every single musician or band as BORROWED some idea or song from people or persons'. To say KISS has not had an original idea is irrelevant. All musicians are influenced by something.
There's influence and then there's outright theft.

Gene liked the Beatles. You can hear it in his bass playing, his harmony vocals and a couple of songs on his solo album. That's influence.

Paul heard Pour Some Sugar On Me on the radio and thought "I'll fucking have some of that" and went off to write Read My Body. That's theft.
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Re: Who was Hotter Than Hell first?

Post by battra »

THUNDERKISS66 wrote: Tue Sep 14, 2021 4:37 pm Just to-be-clear. No band or musician has had an original idea. Every single musician or band as BORROWED some idea or song from people or persons'. To say KISS has not had an original idea is irrelevant. All musicians are influenced by something.
Have you met Steve Vai or Jimi Hendrix?

:)

I'd also posit that being influenced by and stealing from are not the same thing.

Ace was influenced by Jimi, but he did not steal from Jimi, that I'm aware of. Influenced as, borrowed some techniques.
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Re: Who was Hotter Than Hell first?

Post by battra »

TheKISSProject7312 wrote: Tue Sep 14, 2021 4:42 pm
THUNDERKISS66 wrote: Tue Sep 14, 2021 4:37 pm Just to-be-clear. No band or musician has had an original idea. Every single musician or band as BORROWED some idea or song from people or persons'. To say KISS has not had an original idea is irrelevant. All musicians are influenced by something.
There's influence and then there's outright theft.

Gene liked the Beatles. You can hear it in his bass playing, his harmony vocals and a couple of songs on his solo album. That's influence.

Paul heard Pour Some Sugar On Me on the radio and thought "I'll fucking have some of that" and went off to write Read My Body. That's theft.
Exactly that.

Ace liked oh, damn, what song is it? Crosstown Traffic I think, where Jimi does this diad riff where he bends up the lower note to the higher note..a throwaway technique in a single song, but Ace used it all over the place.

Ace listened to guys like Page, Clapton, etc and used the 12 bar turn around chords to end off his solos.

Paul heard "All Right Now" and wrote "Hotter Than Hell," that was "me basically re-writing that song."

I got no issues with theft, but I'm gonna be pedantic on this and point out the difference between influence and theft.
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Re: Who was Hotter Than Hell first?

Post by Statuegirl21 »

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Re: Who was Hotter Than Hell first?

Post by The Kiss Guy »

Actually....KISS rips itself off in a way.

Listen to the chorus of "Hotter than Hell"....

Hot Hot...Hotter than Hell

Doesn't that strike a resemblance to the chorus of KISS' first single "Nothin' to Lose"...

You Got Got...Nothin' to Lose

Food for thought
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Re: Who was Hotter Than Hell first?

Post by caligari »

TheKISSProject7312 wrote: Tue Sep 14, 2021 4:21 pm It's sad. The longer you stay a KISS fan, the more you start to realise that they've never had an original idea in their lives.

My user name refers to my website where I review every single song recorded by the band. I never really realised it before, but the amount of KISS songs that completely and blatantly steal from other songs by other bands is absolutely shocking.
Can you give us a
Link and Access to your Site?
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Re: Who was Hotter Than Hell first?

Post by torgotheme »

So did Styx invent the phrase "hotter than hell"? I thought it's been around for a while, used to describe the weather, food, or what have you. I personally don't think our band stole it from some other band's obscure-looking promo poster.

Classifying what "Read My Body" is is a whole nother thread (I call that one "lame bandwagoning").
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Re: Who was Hotter Than Hell first?

Post by mot$$33 »

Styx is a river in hell, thus the phrase on their poster.
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Re: Who was Hotter Than Hell first?

Post by Kisscandinavia »

TheKISSProject7312 wrote: Tue Sep 14, 2021 4:21 pm It's sad. The longer you stay a KISS fan, the more you start to realise that they've never had an original idea in their lives.

My user name refers to my website where I review every single song recorded by the band. I never really realised it before, but the amount of KISS songs that completely and blatantly steal from other songs by other bands is absolutely shocking.

So true :(
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Re: Who was Hotter Than Hell first?

Post by jannep17 »

Every musician steals with pride.
You can take the most original musicians in the world and ask them, and they would say: "Yeah, I heard this and that and did my take on it..."
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Re: Who was Hotter Than Hell first?

Post by Much Too Soon »

Are you implying that Styx “invented” the phrase Hotter Than Hell?
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Re: Who was Hotter Than Hell first?

Post by ypke »

caligari wrote: Tue Sep 14, 2021 7:23 pm
TheKISSProject7312 wrote: Tue Sep 14, 2021 4:21 pm It's sad. The longer you stay a KISS fan, the more you start to realise that they've never had an original idea in their lives.

My user name refers to my website where I review every single song recorded by the band. I never really realised it before, but the amount of KISS songs that completely and blatantly steal from other songs by other bands is absolutely shocking.
Can you give us a
Link and Access to your Site?
Please do, cause Google didn't find it just searching by your name.
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Re: Who was Hotter Than Hell first?

Post by Put the sex in my ex »

TheKISSProject7312 wrote: Tue Sep 14, 2021 4:42 pm
THUNDERKISS66 wrote: Tue Sep 14, 2021 4:37 pm Just to-be-clear. No band or musician has had an original idea. Every single musician or band as BORROWED some idea or song from people or persons'. To say KISS has not had an original idea is irrelevant. All musicians are influenced by something.
There's influence and then there's outright theft.

Gene liked the Beatles. You can hear it in his bass playing, his harmony vocals and a couple of songs on his solo album. That's influence.

Paul heard Pour Some Sugar On Me on the radio and thought "I'll fucking have some of that" and went off to write Read My Body. That's theft.

But didn't Bob Halligan say something like that the songs(Rise to it, Read my body) were almost finished when he brought them to Paul?

That makes your "Paul listened on radio" story false
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Re: Who was Hotter Than Hell first?

Post by peterj116 »

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Re: Who was Hotter Than Hell first?

Post by gene therapist »

On a positive note regarding "stealing", at least they've never claimed to be original. Then again, I much prefer the stylistic bandwagon-hopping of Kiss over stealing from your own repertoire over and over a la AC/DC. Rock and roll is seldom "original" anyway. Kiss at least provide some variety.
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Re: Who was Hotter Than Hell first?

Post by Tito »

THUNDERKISS66 wrote: Tue Sep 14, 2021 4:37 pm Just to-be-clear. No band or musician has had an original idea. Every single musician or band as BORROWED some idea or song from people or persons'. To say KISS has not had an original idea is irrelevant. All musicians are influenced by something.
Borrowing and being influenced and/or inspired by something, and having original ideas can and often do coexist. To say "no band or musician has had an original idea"... it would be easy to list examples from the late '60s alone where this clearly is not true.
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Re: Who was Hotter Than Hell first?

Post by Kissoff »

peterj116 wrote: Wed Sep 15, 2021 12:02 am https://thekissproject7312.wordpress.com
Nice!!!
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Re: Who was Hotter Than Hell first?

Post by banks »

Put the sex in my ex wrote: Tue Sep 14, 2021 11:58 pm
TheKISSProject7312 wrote: Tue Sep 14, 2021 4:42 pm
THUNDERKISS66 wrote: Tue Sep 14, 2021 4:37 pm Just to-be-clear. No band or musician has had an original idea. Every single musician or band as BORROWED some idea or song from people or persons'. To say KISS has not had an original idea is irrelevant. All musicians are influenced by something.
There's influence and then there's outright theft.

Gene liked the Beatles. You can hear it in his bass playing, his harmony vocals and a couple of songs on his solo album. That's influence.

Paul heard Pour Some Sugar On Me on the radio and thought "I'll fucking have some of that" and went off to write Read My Body. That's theft.

But didn't Bob Halligan say something like that the songs(Rise to it, Read my body) were almost finished when he brought them to Paul?

That makes your "Paul listened on radio" story false
I seem to recall Paul saying that Bob Halligan wrote the RMB chorus and that Bob had already started RTI before Paul became involved.
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Re: Who was Hotter Than Hell first?

Post by gabbagabba »

TheKISSProject7312 wrote: Tue Sep 14, 2021 4:21 pm It's sad. The longer you stay a KISS fan, the more you start to realise that they've never had an original idea in their lives.
True, unfortunately.
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Re: Who was Hotter Than Hell first?

Post by Mr Slow »

The Kiss Guy wrote: Tue Sep 14, 2021 6:13 pm Actually....KISS rips itself off in a way.

Listen to the chorus of "Hotter than Hell"....

Hot Hot...Hotter than Hell

Doesn't that strike a resemblance to the chorus of KISS' first single "Nothin' to Lose"...

You Got Got...Nothin' to Lose

Food for thought
Here’s some more food for you. “Bop, Bop, Boppin’ the Blues”

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Re: Who was Hotter Than Hell first?

Post by Coventry1973 »

All musicians "borrow". The most blatant one I heard was Cheap Trick "The Flame", which is a total "borrow" of a song called "Natures Way" by Randy California of the band Spirit in 1970

Natures Way by Spirit

The Flame by Cheap Trick

And I love Cheap Trick so I'm not busting on them.
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Re: Who was Hotter Than Hell first?

Post by savage_dreams »

if you think either kiss or styx coined the phrase "hotter than hell" youre dumber than dirt.
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Re: Who was Hotter Than Hell first?

Post by StillAlive »

Coventry1973 wrote: Wed Sep 15, 2021 5:10 am All musicians "borrow". The most blatant one I heard was Cheap Trick "The Flame", which is a total "borrow" of a song called "Natures Way" by Randy California of the band Spirit in 1970
Poor Randy California.
Didn't Zeppelin also "steal" Stairway to Heaven from Randy California/Spirit :wink:
As well as steal from many other black artists.
Discuss...
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Re: Who was Hotter Than Hell first?

Post by Mackemkiss »

Styx absolutely stink! I can't believe people actually listen to them :lol:
Even someone as middle of the road as REO Speedwagon are miles better
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Re: Who was Hotter Than Hell first?

Post by Kissologist »

So... there's no use in discussing Motley's Hotter Than Hell? :P

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Re: Who was Hotter Than Hell first?

Post by StillAlive »

Image
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Re: Who was Hotter Than Hell first?

Post by StillAlive »

Mackemkiss wrote: Wed Sep 15, 2021 6:57 am Styx absolutely stink! I can't believe people actually listen to them :lol:
Even someone as middle of the road as REO Speedwagon are miles better
Styx > REO Speedwagon

They've got some excellent tines. Miss America, Suite Madame Blue, Crystal Ball, etc.
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Re: Who was Hotter Than Hell first?

Post by HeavyMetal1 »

Its crazy how you discover shit. My friend just pointed out to me how Maidens Children of the damned borrowed from a Hendrix tune
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Re: Who was Hotter Than Hell first?

Post by HeavyMetal1 »

Even the Stones. It must be hell from Undercover, was borrowed for Rock in a hard place 4 years later
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Re: Who was Hotter Than Hell first?

Post by nfarend »

StarChild1978 wrote: Tue Sep 14, 2021 2:15 pm An interesting observation: I own this original Styx promo poster but it doesn’t have a date printed on it. I’ve seen two sources stating it is from 1972. If so, it predates KISS’ HTH album by a couple of years.
And it wasn't just the album title, it's also the backcover. Well, at least somewhat.
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Re: Who was Hotter Than Hell first?

Post by StarChild1978 »

Much Too Soon wrote: Tue Sep 14, 2021 11:43 pm Are you implying that Styx “invented” the phrase Hotter Than Hell?
What gave you the idea the post was implying that?

It compares two specific items within a two year period and asked which band used it first. Nothing to do with the origin of the phrase.

I find the similarities interesting.
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Re: Who was Hotter Than Hell first?

Post by Pollux »

You do what you do and when it looks like you is all it takes. When it sounds, looks, feels (etc) original / personal it propably is.
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Re: Who was Hotter Than Hell first?

Post by bassmansteiny »

gene therapist wrote: Wed Sep 15, 2021 12:49 am On a positive note regarding "stealing", at least they've never claimed to be original. Then again, I much prefer the stylistic bandwagon-hopping of Kiss over stealing from your own repertoire over and over a la AC/DC. Rock and roll is seldom "original" anyway. Kiss at least provide some variety.
While I have a tremendous amount of respect for AC/DC, I totally agree with what you said. I always liked the variety of KISS.
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Re: Who was Hotter Than Hell first?

Post by bassmansteiny »

Coventry1973 wrote: Wed Sep 15, 2021 5:10 am All musicians "borrow". The most blatant one I heard was Cheap Trick "The Flame", which is a total "borrow" of a song called "Natures Way" by Randy California of the band Spirit in 1970

Natures Way by Spirit

The Flame by Cheap Trick

And I love Cheap Trick so I'm not busting on them.
I know I'm in a small minority but I really like The Flame. Then again I have always been a little sappy for a good rock ballad.
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Re: Who was Hotter Than Hell first?

Post by Stlouisblue »

It looks like Nick traced it...
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Re: Who was Hotter Than Hell first?

Post by KISSTRONAUT »

Styx - Hotter than a muggy summer day in Chicago at best.
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Re: Who was Hotter Than Hell first?

Post by Ludwig Paiste 77 »

KISS, why?

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Re: Who was Hotter Than Hell first?

Post by Much Too Soon »

StarChild1978 wrote: Wed Sep 15, 2021 11:54 am
Much Too Soon wrote: Tue Sep 14, 2021 11:43 pm Are you implying that Styx “invented” the phrase Hotter Than Hell?
What gave you the idea the post was implying that?

It compares two specific items within a two year period and asked which band used it first. Nothing to do with the origin of the phrase.

I find the similarities interesting.
It was a question ds.