Mark G Etess Arena SOLD OUT!

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Re: Mark G Etess Arena SOLD OUT!

Post by Much Too Soon »

In the Suds wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 8:40 am
Much Too Soon wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 5:41 am
TwistedTaste wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 5:17 am
Much Too Soon wrote: Fri Jul 23, 2021 9:15 pm


They “barely sell out shows” because their algorithms are designed to gain the maximum dollar for each ticket. Instead of allowing scalpers to get them and jack up the price. The entire system is designed to “barely sell out shows”.

You’ve just proven our point.

Thanks.
Lmao. Algorithms! Lol
Are algorithms the reason they are playing only 1 night in each city? Algorithms are causing the groupons too, right?

Get outta here with this crap :D
You sound funny but demonstrate that you truly live under a rock.
There’s not enough demand to sell out two or three shows at the increased FLOATING prices
being charged for each ticket. It’s designed to make more money on one show than on two shows
charging the old ticket prices.

Look Patrick. They are earning an AVERAGE ticket price of $105 each. For every Groupon $20 ticket sold,
another sold for $190. Artificial intelligence in these programs are MUCH smarter than you.

But then again…..so is a wrist watch.

A5CBD3BB-38F0-435B-96D4-11E65EA90CA7.jpeg
If the current numbers are all down to a rigged algorithm, and the 1996/97 success was from actual...you know....demand...
...then it doesn't prove your point at all. In fact you have self-owned yourself quite hard.

lol
The fools here will believe you. But even a dim bulb understands what I’ve laid out.
So you lay the above yap out for me in some coherent thought. I’ll be waiting. 🥱😴
Kiss is making more money per ticket and more revenue per show than ever. By raising prices
and then also offering cheap tickets as well….they are balancing demand to the seats they want
to supply by controlling ticket prices using algorithms much smarter than you and definitely smarter than twisted taste. They hit the sweet spot on average most of the time.

It’s called dynamic pricing sunshine 🌞
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Re: Mark G Etess Arena SOLD OUT!

Post by misterhand80 »

Much Too Soon wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 9:55 am
In the Suds wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 8:40 am
Much Too Soon wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 5:41 am
TwistedTaste wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 5:17 am

Lmao. Algorithms! Lol
Are algorithms the reason they are playing only 1 night in each city? Algorithms are causing the groupons too, right?

Get outta here with this crap :D
You sound funny but demonstrate that you truly live under a rock.
There’s not enough demand to sell out two or three shows at the increased FLOATING prices
being charged for each ticket. It’s designed to make more money on one show than on two shows
charging the old ticket prices.

Look Patrick. They are earning an AVERAGE ticket price of $105 each. For every Groupon $20 ticket sold,
another sold for $190. Artificial intelligence in these programs are MUCH smarter than you.

But then again…..so is a wrist watch.

A5CBD3BB-38F0-435B-96D4-11E65EA90CA7.jpeg
If the current numbers are all down to a rigged algorithm, and the 1996/97 success was from actual...you know....demand...
...then it doesn't prove your point at all. In fact you have self-owned yourself quite hard.

lol
The fools here will believe you. But even a dim bulb understands what I’ve laid out.
So you lay the above yap out for me in some coherent thought. I’ll be waiting. 🥱😴
Kiss is making more money per ticket and more revenue per show than ever. By raising prices
and then also offering cheap tickets as well….they are balancing demand to the seats they want
to supply by controlling ticket prices using algorithms much smarter than you and definitely smarter than twisted taste. They hit the sweet spot on average most of the time.

It’s called dynamic pricing sunshine 🌞
Well stated. Comma, comma, comma chameleon is your friend.

It’s called dynamic pricing, sunshine 🌞
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Re: Mark G Etess Arena SOLD OUT!

Post by muddfoot »

Hey how bout the show?
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Re: Mark G Etess Arena SOLD OUT!

Post by In the Suds »

I like how the brain scientists on here celebrate the 'dynamic pricing' that makes their concert tickets more expensive.

:)
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Re: Mark G Etess Arena SOLD OUT!

Post by SpinningAcorn »

Much Too Soon wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 9:55 am
It’s called dynamic pricing sunshine 🌞
And when has Kiss ever gotten the upside on that?

Dynamic pricing is supposed to work both ways but for kiss it seems it only works going down.

If you want to see true dynamic pricing look at some NFL games with heavy demand. You'll see seats that regularly go for say $250 going for $1500 or more. That is real Dynamic pricing.

Now for KISS, it works in the reverse.. Just like the Tulsa show that wasn't selling....$750 2nd row gets dumped to $250.

I also find it hilarious that now some justify kiss not selling out till the end to be a good thing. For some reason they think more increased advertising cost to sell and heavily discounted tickets to finally get them to move is a good thing. Actually wth Dynamic pricing in place, its far better to sell out early for maximum revenue. But many have no clue what they're talking about but it sounds good to some other posters who don't know any better as well.

Also love the fake comparisons to the reunions tour vs. This one. From the laughable using the c p i .... to not taking into account the millions upon Millions left on the table back then because people were having to get tickets through ticket brokers. There were shows back then were $60 seats were getting sold for 400 500 or more. And no telling how much people were paying for first and second row to the ticket brokers.

I did see another post where someone admitted you can't extrapolate the reunion tour date numbers ... because only 30 or shows information was available. That is true. But I hope the poster who said that and others never tried to extrapolate other shows from the 80s or 90s and came up with pretend averages for those tours. But I would guess that Common Sense rule only applied in this one case. You can bet it didn't apply to hot in the shade, Revenge crazy nights or other tours with hardly any real box scores.
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Re: Mark G Etess Arena SOLD OUT!

Post by nibbler1982 »

SpinningAcorn wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 10:57 am
Much Too Soon wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 9:55 am
It’s called dynamic pricing sunshine 🌞
And when has Kiss ever gotten the upside on that?

Dynamic pricing is supposed to work both ways but for kiss it seems it only works going down.

If you want to see true dynamic pricing look at some NFL games with heavy demand. You'll see seats that regularly go for say $250 going for $1500 or more. That is real Dynamic pricing.

Now for KISS, it works in the reverse.. Just like the Tulsa show that wasn't selling....$750 2nd row gets dumped to $250.

I also find it hilarious that now some justify kiss not selling out till the end to be a good thing. For some reason they think more increased advertising cost to sell and heavily discounted tickets to finally get them to move is a good thing. Actually wth Dynamic pricing in place, its far better to sell out early for maximum revenue. But many have no clue what they're talking about but it sounds good to some other posters who don't know any better as well.

Also love the fake comparisons to the reunions tour vs. This one. From the laughable using the c p i .... to not taking into account the millions upon Millions left on the table back then because people were having to get tickets through ticket brokers. There were shows back then were $60 seats were getting sold for 400 500 or more. And no telling how much people were paying for first and second row to the ticket brokers.

I did see another post where someone admitted you can't extrapolate the reunion tour date numbers ... because only 30 or shows information was available. That is true. But I hope the poster who said that and others never tried to extrapolate other shows from the 80s or 90s and came up with pretend averages for those tours. But I would guess that Common Sense rule only applied in this one case. You can bet it didn't apply to hot in the shade, Revenge crazy nights or other tours with hardly any real box scores.
Brother Spininxie…let’s delve a little more on this…


“Now for KISS, it works in the reverse.. Just like the Tulsa show that wasn't selling....$750 2nd row gets dumped to $250.”

All they ever wanted was $200 for those seats. By selling whatever ones they did foe $750 jammed the scalpers from doing the same. Then when they finally dropped it…they STILL got $50 more than they wanted!

Dynamic pricing at it’s finest!
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Re: Mark G Etess Arena SOLD OUT!

Post by SpinningAcorn »

Always hilarious seeing people talk about Dynamic pricing who have no idea what it really is

And because it's not working in the correct way for Kiss some fans move the goalposts and change Dynamic pricing into something that really isn't

Some around here move the goalposts more than fauci.

But they're the same people who say Industries trades are infallible and then go around and bust them when they don't have kiss doing as well as they thought they did.
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Re: Mark G Etess Arena SOLD OUT!

Post by nibbler1982 »

SpinningAcorn wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 11:08 am Always hilarious seeing people talk about Dynamic pricing who have no idea what it really is

And because it's not working in the correct way for Kiss some fans move the goalposts and change Dynamic pricing into something that really isn't

Some around here move the goalposts more than fauci.

But they're the same people who say Industries trades are infallible and then go around and bust them when they don't have kiss doing as well as they thought they did.
No…I explained it QUITE succinctly.

Although for you it’s unfortunate it decimates your position.
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Re: Mark G Etess Arena SOLD OUT!

Post by mot$$33 »

nibbler1982 wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 11:01 am
SpinningAcorn wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 10:57 am
Much Too Soon wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 9:55 am
It’s called dynamic pricing sunshine 🌞
And when has Kiss ever gotten the upside on that?

Dynamic pricing is supposed to work both ways but for kiss it seems it only works going down.

If you want to see true dynamic pricing look at some NFL games with heavy demand. You'll see seats that regularly go for say $250 going for $1500 or more. That is real Dynamic pricing.

Now for KISS, it works in the reverse.. Just like the Tulsa show that wasn't selling....$750 2nd row gets dumped to $250.

I also find it hilarious that now some justify kiss not selling out till the end to be a good thing. For some reason they think more increased advertising cost to sell and heavily discounted tickets to finally get them to move is a good thing. Actually wth Dynamic pricing in place, its far better to sell out early for maximum revenue. But many have no clue what they're talking about but it sounds good to some other posters who don't know any better as well.

Also love the fake comparisons to the reunions tour vs. This one. From the laughable using the c p i .... to not taking into account the millions upon Millions left on the table back then because people were having to get tickets through ticket brokers. There were shows back then were $60 seats were getting sold for 400 500 or more. And no telling how much people were paying for first and second row to the ticket brokers.

I did see another post where someone admitted you can't extrapolate the reunion tour date numbers ... because only 30 or shows information was available. That is true. But I hope the poster who said that and others never tried to extrapolate other shows from the 80s or 90s and came up with pretend averages for those tours. But I would guess that Common Sense rule only applied in this one case. You can bet it didn't apply to hot in the shade, Revenge crazy nights or other tours with hardly any real box scores.
Brother Spininxie…let’s delve a little more on this…


“Now for KISS, it works in the reverse.. Just like the Tulsa show that wasn't selling....$750 2nd row gets dumped to $250.”

All they ever wanted was $200 for those seats. By selling whatever ones they did foe $750 jammed the scalpers from doing the same. Then when they finally dropped it…they STILL got $50 more than they wanted!

Dynamic pricing at it’s finest!

Interesting dialogue. There really is no way to know what the band, management, promoter, ticket seller, etc want to get price wise for certain seats.
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Re: Mark G Etess Arena SOLD OUT!

Post by SpinningAcorn »

mot$$33 wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 11:30 am
nibbler1982 wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 11:01 am
SpinningAcorn wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 10:57 am
Much Too Soon wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 9:55 am
It’s called dynamic pricing sunshine 🌞
And when has Kiss ever gotten the upside on that?

Dynamic pricing is supposed to work both ways but for kiss it seems it only works going down.

If you want to see true dynamic pricing look at some NFL games with heavy demand. You'll see seats that regularly go for say $250 going for $1500 or more. That is real Dynamic pricing.

Now for KISS, it works in the reverse.. Just like the Tulsa show that wasn't selling....$750 2nd row gets dumped to $250.

I also find it hilarious that now some justify kiss not selling out till the end to be a good thing. For some reason they think more increased advertising cost to sell and heavily discounted tickets to finally get them to move is a good thing. Actually wth Dynamic pricing in place, its far better to sell out early for maximum revenue. But many have no clue what they're talking about but it sounds good to some other posters who don't know any better as well.

Also love the fake comparisons to the reunions tour vs. This one. From the laughable using the c p i .... to not taking into account the millions upon Millions left on the table back then because people were having to get tickets through ticket brokers. There were shows back then were $60 seats were getting sold for 400 500 or more. And no telling how much people were paying for first and second row to the ticket brokers.

I did see another post where someone admitted you can't extrapolate the reunion tour date numbers ... because only 30 or shows information was available. That is true. But I hope the poster who said that and others never tried to extrapolate other shows from the 80s or 90s and came up with pretend averages for those tours. But I would guess that Common Sense rule only applied in this one case. You can bet it didn't apply to hot in the shade, Revenge crazy nights or other tours with hardly any real box scores.
Brother Spininxie…let’s delve a little more on this…


“Now for KISS, it works in the reverse.. Just like the Tulsa show that wasn't selling....$750 2nd row gets dumped to $250.”

All they ever wanted was $200 for those seats. By selling whatever ones they did foe $750 jammed the scalpers from doing the same. Then when they finally dropped it…they STILL got $50 more than they wanted!

Dynamic pricing at it’s finest!

Interesting dialogue. There really is no way to know what the band, management, promoter, ticket seller, etc want to get price wise for certain seats.
You are 100% correct. KISS isn't using Dynamic Pricing. All kissing's to do is Discount pricing.

Good luck finding many examples of kiss getting above the stated rates when there's high demand.

Again if you want to see real examples of dynamic pricing look, look at high demand NFL games, college games Major League Baseball. Look at how their prices surge once they go on sale and weeks and weeks after that when there's high demand.

I'm still waiting on several NFL games for their prices to drop till I buy.
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Re: Mark G Etess Arena SOLD OUT!

Post by battra »

You know...

I used to try to battle Nibbs over this too.

But he always comes back to the same thing.

Kiss makes more money now than they ever did.

This is either wrong or it's right. He doesn't care about X, Y, or Z...just looking at how many tickets they're selling at how much.

You can twist and turn and make the same arguments I did, but he's always gonna say the same thing... is X more than Y?

And then, because you're proud...you won't answer. You'll divert from that fact.

I look forward to watching this play out in every single thread Nibbs stars forever.
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Re: Mark G Etess Arena SOLD OUT!

Post by battra »

SpinningAcorn wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 11:35 am Again if you want to see real examples of dynamic pricing look, look at high demand NFL games, college games Major League Baseball. Look at how their prices surge once they go on sale and weeks and weeks after that when there's high demand.

I'm still waiting on several NFL games for their prices to drop till I buy.
Major League Baseball has high demand?

They average about 30K people per game.

That's 65 to 70 percent capacity every single game.

Weird.
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Re: Mark G Etess Arena SOLD OUT!

Post by nibbler1982 »

mot$$33 wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 11:30 am
nibbler1982 wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 11:01 am
SpinningAcorn wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 10:57 am
Much Too Soon wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 9:55 am
It’s called dynamic pricing sunshine 🌞
And when has Kiss ever gotten the upside on that?

Dynamic pricing is supposed to work both ways but for kiss it seems it only works going down.

If you want to see true dynamic pricing look at some NFL games with heavy demand. You'll see seats that regularly go for say $250 going for $1500 or more. That is real Dynamic pricing.

Now for KISS, it works in the reverse.. Just like the Tulsa show that wasn't selling....$750 2nd row gets dumped to $250.

I also find it hilarious that now some justify kiss not selling out till the end to be a good thing. For some reason they think more increased advertising cost to sell and heavily discounted tickets to finally get them to move is a good thing. Actually wth Dynamic pricing in place, its far better to sell out early for maximum revenue. But many have no clue what they're talking about but it sounds good to some other posters who don't know any better as well.

Also love the fake comparisons to the reunions tour vs. This one. From the laughable using the c p i .... to not taking into account the millions upon Millions left on the table back then because people were having to get tickets through ticket brokers. There were shows back then were $60 seats were getting sold for 400 500 or more. And no telling how much people were paying for first and second row to the ticket brokers.

I did see another post where someone admitted you can't extrapolate the reunion tour date numbers ... because only 30 or shows information was available. That is true. But I hope the poster who said that and others never tried to extrapolate other shows from the 80s or 90s and came up with pretend averages for those tours. But I would guess that Common Sense rule only applied in this one case. You can bet it didn't apply to hot in the shade, Revenge crazy nights or other tours with hardly any real box scores.
Brother Spininxie…let’s delve a little more on this…


“Now for KISS, it works in the reverse.. Just like the Tulsa show that wasn't selling....$750 2nd row gets dumped to $250.”

All they ever wanted was $200 for those seats. By selling whatever ones they did foe $750 jammed the scalpers from doing the same. Then when they finally dropped it…they STILL got $50 more than they wanted!

Dynamic pricing at it’s finest!

Interesting dialogue. There really is no way to know what the band, management, promoter, ticket seller, etc want to get price wise for certain seats.
To be exact…true. But they know they’re gonna swell as many tickets as the market will hold.

The only reason everything’s ballooned up is to eliminate tge scalpers. The brokers sell a $200 seat for $750. If the seat’s gonna go for $750, the money might as well go to the band.

Not the broker.
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Re: Mark G Etess Arena SOLD OUT!

Post by SpinningAcorn »

battra wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 11:36 am You know...

I used to try to battle Nibbs over this too.

But he always comes back to the same thing.

Kiss makes more money now than they ever did.

This is either wrong or it's right. He doesn't care about X, Y, or Z...just looking at how many tickets they're selling at how much.

You can twist and turn and make the same arguments I did, but he's always gonna say the same thing... is X more than Y?

And then, because you're proud...you won't answer. You'll divert from that fact.

I look forward to watching this play out in every single thread Nibbs stars forever.

He constantly constantly moves those goalpost it's unbelievable.

Now it's the scalpers he's blaming for Kiss heavily discounting. It's funny how you constantly makes arguments and ignores alleged Dynamic pricing is supposed to be in place.

Just like waiting to sell out at the last minute is a good thing even though all that means is most likely those tickets were heavily discounted.

He keeps confusing fixed cost tickets versus Dynamic pricing when he makes these ridiculous arguments.

But again at least he's done one thing and he says you can't extrapolate tour averages for all those tours back in the seventies, eighties and nineties.... because there is too little data available. Glad to know he believes that. A lot of Kiss fans don't and think 15 box scores equals a tours avg.
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Re: Mark G Etess Arena SOLD OUT!

Post by nibbler1982 »

SpinningAcorn wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 11:53 am
battra wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 11:36 am You know...

I used to try to battle Nibbs over this too.

But he always comes back to the same thing.

Kiss makes more money now than they ever did.

This is either wrong or it's right. He doesn't care about X, Y, or Z...just looking at how many tickets they're selling at how much.

You can twist and turn and make the same arguments I did, but he's always gonna say the same thing... is X more than Y?

And then, because you're proud...you won't answer. You'll divert from that fact.

I look forward to watching this play out in every single thread Nibbs stars forever.

He constantly constantly moves those goalpost it's unbelievable.

Now it's the scalpers he's blaming for Kiss heavily discounting. It's funny how you constantly makes arguments and ignores alleged Dynamic pricing is supposed to be in place.

Just like waiting to sell out at the last minute is a good thing even though all that means is most likely those tickets were heavily discounted.

He keeps confusing fixed cost tickets versus Dynamic pricing when he makes these ridiculous arguments.

But again at least he's done one thing and he says you can't extrapolate tour averages for all those tours back in the seventies, eighties and nineties.... because there is too little data available. Glad to know he believes that. A lot of Kiss fans don't and think 15 box scores equals a tours avg.
Once again…and I REPEAT…

I explained the process of dynamic pricing to you QUITE SUCCINCTLY.

It just unfortunate for you it decimates your position.
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Re: Mark G Etess Arena SOLD OUT!

Post by Grand Classic »

battra wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 11:36 am You know...

I used to try to battle Nibbs over this too.

But he always comes back to the same thing.

Kiss makes more money now than they ever did.

This is either wrong or it's right. He doesn't care about X, Y, or Z...just looking at how many tickets they're selling at how much.

You can twist and turn and make the same arguments I did, but he's always gonna say the same thing... is X more than Y?

And then, because you're proud...you won't answer. You'll divert from that fact.

I look forward to watching this play out in every single thread Nibbs stars forever.
Did you recently find out that you share a love for cosplay and that's why you are Nibbler's biggest champion now after you used to call him out all the time on his bullshit? Do you feel you were wrong all those times before now?
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Re: Mark G Etess Arena SOLD OUT!

Post by In the Suds »

Grand Classic wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 1:07 pm
battra wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 11:36 am You know...

I used to try to battle Nibbs over this too.

But he always comes back to the same thing.

Kiss makes more money now than they ever did.

This is either wrong or it's right. He doesn't care about X, Y, or Z...just looking at how many tickets they're selling at how much.

You can twist and turn and make the same arguments I did, but he's always gonna say the same thing... is X more than Y?

And then, because you're proud...you won't answer. You'll divert from that fact.

I look forward to watching this play out in every single thread Nibbs stars forever.
Did you recently find out that you share a love for cosplay and that's why you are Nibbler's biggest champion now after you used to call him out all the time on his bullshit? Do you feel you were wrong all those times before now?
I'm really enjoying battra's new 'reasonable guy who's above it all' guise. As if he's not one of the all time champs of tedious multi-page arguing.
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Re: Mark G Etess Arena SOLD OUT!

Post by Grand Classic »

In the Suds wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 1:16 pm
Grand Classic wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 1:07 pm
battra wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 11:36 am You know...

I used to try to battle Nibbs over this too.

But he always comes back to the same thing.

Kiss makes more money now than they ever did.

This is either wrong or it's right. He doesn't care about X, Y, or Z...just looking at how many tickets they're selling at how much.

You can twist and turn and make the same arguments I did, but he's always gonna say the same thing... is X more than Y?

And then, because you're proud...you won't answer. You'll divert from that fact.

I look forward to watching this play out in every single thread Nibbs stars forever.
Did you recently find out that you share a love for cosplay and that's why you are Nibbler's biggest champion now after you used to call him out all the time on his bullshit? Do you feel you were wrong all those times before now?
I'm really enjoying battra's new 'reasonable guy who's above it all' guise. As if he's not one of the all time champs of tedious multi-page arguing.
Yep. He's been a big time instigator here for YEARS, which is fine - but it's fucking laughable that he's trying to come across now as the adult in the room who is above such banter and back and forth arguing.
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Re: Mark G Etess Arena SOLD OUT!

Post by SpinningAcorn »

nibbler1982 wrote: Thu Jul 22, 2021 8:19 am
Chaim Wigz wrote: Thu Jul 22, 2021 8:01 am
CStomp1 wrote: Thu Jul 22, 2021 7:29 am
Anomaly wrote: Wed Jul 21, 2021 5:08 pm Sellouts weeks ahead of a show are... good now?

(This is about to go over the heads of some.)
Very perceptive. I recall the discussions on this board a year or two ago about this very thing.
I concur. An EXCELLENT point!
I second that motion.

It shows money was left on the table.

The market would withstand higher prices.


Tickets have been on sale for the show for what a year or more?

But it would have been better if kiss would have waited to sell up to the very end??

I love that logic. Once again proving mr. DOT has no idea what dynamic pricing means.

With Dynamic pricing, prices go up when demand is high and prices go down when demand is low. Mr. DOT bel8eves it's best when kiss sells tickets when demand is low and their prices only go down not up.

He gets decimated time and time again but he keeps coming back like he actually made an argument or point.

He really has no idea whatsoever between a fixed price Model.... where you would hope the tickets don't sell out until towards the end versus Dynamic pricing where you want high demand and higher prices and quick selloutd.


I also see how he's always throwing in foreign shows to try and boost things. I recently noticed him doing it to jack up Gene Simmons solo tour averages. And now to try to act like KISS is playing stadiums on the end of the road. The only real stadium KISS might play on end of the road in the US might be Citi Field if they're lucky. And they could always configure that to seek 25,000. I certainly doubt he ever said kiss on the creatures tour was a stadium band. And I doubt he threw in those averages like you did trying to boost Gene's. Move those goalposts move them move them.

Of course "Jot the Dot" will ignore all reality and claim he won again.
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Re: Mark G Etess Arena SOLD OUT!

Post by nibbler1982 »

SpinningAcorn wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 2:24 pm
nibbler1982 wrote: Thu Jul 22, 2021 8:19 am
Chaim Wigz wrote: Thu Jul 22, 2021 8:01 am
CStomp1 wrote: Thu Jul 22, 2021 7:29 am

Very perceptive. I recall the discussions on this board a year or two ago about this very thing.
I concur. An EXCELLENT point!
I second that motion.

It shows money was left on the table.

The market would withstand higher prices.


Tickets have been on sale for the show for what a year or more?

But it would have been better if kiss would have waited to sell up to the very end??

I love that logic. Once again proving mr. DOT has no idea what dynamic pricing means.

With Dynamic pricing, prices go up when demand is high and prices go down when demand is low. Mr. DOT bel8eves it's best when kiss sells tickets when demand is low and their prices only go down not up.

He gets decimated time and time again but he keeps coming back like he actually made an argument or point.

He really has no idea whatsoever between a fixed price Model.... where you would hope the tickets don't sell out until towards the end versus Dynamic pricing where you want high demand and higher prices and quick selloutd.


I also see how he's always throwing in foreign shows to try and boost things. I recently noticed him doing it to jack up Gene Simmons solo tour averages. And now to try to act like KISS is playing stadiums on the end of the road. The only real stadium KISS might play on end of the road in the US might be Citi Field if they're lucky. And they could always configure that to seek 25,000. I certainly doubt he ever said kiss on the creatures tour was a stadium band. And I doubt he threw in those averages like you did trying to boost Gene's. Move those goalposts move them move them.

Of course "Jot the Dot" will ignore all reality and claim he won again.
There are none so blind as those that will not see.
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Re: Mark G Etess Arena SOLD OUT!

Post by battra »

SpinningAcorn wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 11:53 am
battra wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 11:36 am You know...

I used to try to battle Nibbs over this too.

But he always comes back to the same thing.

Kiss makes more money now than they ever did.

This is either wrong or it's right. He doesn't care about X, Y, or Z...just looking at how many tickets they're selling at how much.

You can twist and turn and make the same arguments I did, but he's always gonna say the same thing... is X more than Y?

And then, because you're proud...you won't answer. You'll divert from that fact.

I look forward to watching this play out in every single thread Nibbs stars forever.

He constantly constantly moves those goalpost it's unbelievable.

Now it's the scalpers he's blaming for Kiss heavily discounting. It's funny how you constantly makes arguments and ignores alleged Dynamic pricing is supposed to be in place.

Just like waiting to sell out at the last minute is a good thing even though all that means is most likely those tickets were heavily discounted.

He keeps confusing fixed cost tickets versus Dynamic pricing when he makes these ridiculous arguments.

But again at least he's done one thing and he says you can't extrapolate tour averages for all those tours back in the seventies, eighties and nineties.... because there is too little data available. Glad to know he believes that. A lot of Kiss fans don't and think 15 box scores equals a tours avg.
That's a lot of words to say nothing.

He comes back to the same thing every single time.
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Re: Mark G Etess Arena SOLD OUT!

Post by battra »

Grand Classic wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 1:07 pm
battra wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 11:36 am You know...

I used to try to battle Nibbs over this too.

But he always comes back to the same thing.

Kiss makes more money now than they ever did.

This is either wrong or it's right. He doesn't care about X, Y, or Z...just looking at how many tickets they're selling at how much.

You can twist and turn and make the same arguments I did, but he's always gonna say the same thing... is X more than Y?

And then, because you're proud...you won't answer. You'll divert from that fact.

I look forward to watching this play out in every single thread Nibbs stars forever.
Did you recently find out that you share a love for cosplay and that's why you are Nibbler's biggest champion now after you used to call him out all the time on his bullshit? Do you feel you were wrong all those times before now?
You know.

When I first heard of Cosplay about 25 years ago...I thought it was weird.

Still do, but I'm not about to yuck on anyone's yum.

Oh, I totally know I was in the wrong to be fighting for this singular point that means nothing.
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Re: Mark G Etess Arena SOLD OUT!

Post by battra »

In the Suds wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 1:16 pm
Grand Classic wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 1:07 pm
battra wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 11:36 am You know...

I used to try to battle Nibbs over this too.

But he always comes back to the same thing.

Kiss makes more money now than they ever did.

This is either wrong or it's right. He doesn't care about X, Y, or Z...just looking at how many tickets they're selling at how much.

You can twist and turn and make the same arguments I did, but he's always gonna say the same thing... is X more than Y?

And then, because you're proud...you won't answer. You'll divert from that fact.

I look forward to watching this play out in every single thread Nibbs stars forever.
Did you recently find out that you share a love for cosplay and that's why you are Nibbler's biggest champion now after you used to call him out all the time on his bullshit? Do you feel you were wrong all those times before now?
I'm really enjoying battra's new 'reasonable guy who's above it all' guise. As if he's not one of the all time champs of tedious multi-page arguing.
Oh, on most days, I'm totally above it, but ya know...what the real bitch of a mental illness is?

When you have an episode and you just can't let go of something wholly meaningless and then yup, I go page after page about nothing important.

Then at night, when I try to sleep, I keep thinking about that argument...and what I should've said, and how so and so was so unreasonable for not admitting they were wrong.

I'm sorry that I have OCD and sorry it bugs you, man.

I'm trying.
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Re: Mark G Etess Arena SOLD OUT!

Post by battra »

Grand Classic wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 1:21 pm Yep. He's been a big time instigator here for YEARS, which is fine - but it's fucking laughable that he's trying to come across now as the adult in the room who is above such banter and back and forth arguing.
Oh.

I never said wasn't an instigator.

I don't want to be now though.
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Re: Mark G Etess Arena SOLD OUT!

Post by Grand Classic »

battra wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 3:07 pm
Grand Classic wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 1:21 pm Yep. He's been a big time instigator here for YEARS, which is fine - but it's fucking laughable that he's trying to come across now as the adult in the room who is above such banter and back and forth arguing.
Oh.

I never said wasn't an instigator.

I don't want to be now though.
So you have had your found Jesus moment so to speak and from now on - there is a new Battra in town?
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Re: Mark G Etess Arena SOLD OUT!

Post by battra »

Grand Classic wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 3:09 pm
battra wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 3:07 pm
Grand Classic wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 1:21 pm Yep. He's been a big time instigator here for YEARS, which is fine - but it's fucking laughable that he's trying to come across now as the adult in the room who is above such banter and back and forth arguing.
Oh.

I never said wasn't an instigator.

I don't want to be now though.
So you have had your found Jesus moment so to speak and from now on - there is a new Battra in town?
Hey man,

I will readily admit that I struggle with my OCD on a daily basis.

Hopefully, I'll be able to continue to not deal with silly things for pages and pages.
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Re: Mark G Etess Arena SOLD OUT!

Post by Grand Classic »

battra wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 3:29 pm
Grand Classic wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 3:09 pm
battra wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 3:07 pm
Grand Classic wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 1:21 pm Yep. He's been a big time instigator here for YEARS, which is fine - but it's fucking laughable that he's trying to come across now as the adult in the room who is above such banter and back and forth arguing.
Oh.

I never said wasn't an instigator.

I don't want to be now though.
So you have had your found Jesus moment so to speak and from now on - there is a new Battra in town?
Hey man,

I will readily admit that I struggle with my OCD on a daily basis.

Hopefully, I'll be able to continue to not deal with silly things for pages and pages.
I have ADD and OCD as well, so I am well aware of this struggle. Just seems odd that after many years - NOW you want to make the effort. I guess better than late than never. I wish you the best.
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Re: Mark G Etess Arena SOLD OUT!

Post by battra »

Grand Classic wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 3:37 pm I have ADD and OCD as well, so I am well aware of this struggle. Just seems odd that after many years - NOW you want to make the effort. I guess better than late than never. I wish you the best.
You assume quite a lot in this post.

I've always wanted to be better.

You wanna hear some truth?

In the past 15 months:
My mother died.
My stedpdad died
My kitten died
My FIL died on my birthday
My catalytic converter was stolen (twice)
My job was eliminated
A friend was murdered

I mean, honestly, there's more, and I just don't remember it all, and some of it I won't divulge.

But I went through absolute hell for the past year. Yeah, it really, really makes me want to be better for some reason. I'm sorry I wasn't ready before.
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Re: Mark G Etess Arena SOLD OUT!

Post by Much Too Soon »

In the Suds wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 10:39 am I like how the brain scientists on here celebrate the 'dynamic pricing' that makes their concert tickets more expensive.

:)
What dynamic pricing does is illuminate statistically what was actually being earned by all of the second hand sellers known as scalpers in then70s - 90’s. And what they were charging and earning in the eras where one couldn’t get a ticket at face value. And one couldn’t get the data to find out total revenue per show. There PROBABLY is little to no difference in the total revenue per show between now ….and…. then. Other than that revenue is going to the concert promoter that is reporting it and not ticket hoarders that quietly pocketed the difference.
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Re: Mark G Etess Arena SOLD OUT!

Post by Grand Classic »

battra wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 3:54 pm
Grand Classic wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 3:37 pm I have ADD and OCD as well, so I am well aware of this struggle. Just seems odd that after many years - NOW you want to make the effort. I guess better than late than never. I wish you the best.
You assume quite a lot in this post.

I've always wanted to be better.

You wanna hear some truth?

In the past 15 months:
My mother died.
My stedpdad died
My kitten died
My FIL died on my birthday
My catalytic converter was stolen (twice)
My job was eliminated
A friend was murdered

I mean, honestly, there's more, and I just don't remember it all, and some of it I won't divulge.

But I went through absolute hell for the past year. Yeah, it really, really makes me want to be better for some reason. I'm sorry I wasn't ready before.
I am terribly sorry to hear all of that and I was being sincere when I said I wish you the best.

It is the reason why I told you that I have OCD and ADD, because I understood on that level. I could never understand what you are going through and I am truly sorry.
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Re: Mark G Etess Arena SOLD OUT!

Post by Much Too Soon »

SpinningAcorn wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 10:57 am
Much Too Soon wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 9:55 am
It’s called dynamic pricing sunshine 🌞
And when has Kiss ever gotten the upside on that?

Dynamic pricing is supposed to work both ways but for kiss it seems it only works going down.

If you want to see true dynamic pricing look at some NFL games with heavy demand. You'll see seats that regularly go for say $250 going for $1500 or more. That is real Dynamic pricing.

Now for KISS, it works in the reverse.. Just like the Tulsa show that wasn't selling....$750 2nd row gets dumped to $250.

I also find it hilarious that now some justify kiss not selling out till the end to be a good thing. For some reason they think more increased advertising cost to sell and heavily discounted tickets to finally get them to move is a good thing. Actually wth Dynamic pricing in place, its far better to sell out early for maximum revenue. But many have no clue what they're talking about but it sounds good to some other posters who don't know any better as well.

Also love the fake comparisons to the reunions tour vs. This one. From the laughable using the c p i .... to not taking into account the millions upon Millions left on the table back then because people were having to get tickets through ticket brokers. There were shows back then were $60 seats were getting sold for 400 500 or more. And no telling how much people were paying for first and second row to the ticket brokers.

I did see another post where someone admitted you can't extrapolate the reunion tour date numbers ... because only 30 or shows information was available. That is true. But I hope the poster who said that and others never tried to extrapolate other shows from the 80s or 90s and came up with pretend averages for those tours. But I would guess that Common Sense rule only applied in this one case. You can bet it didn't apply to hot in the shade, Revenge crazy nights or other tours with hardly any real box scores.
I’ll just give you this Acorn…you are good at arguing and obfuscating….but I bet you were incapable of balancing a simple checkbook. All the data is out there for you to devour. The average ticket price, the average attendance the average gate receipts. As well as all the above per show too.

In reality folks here have provided a baseball box score complete with stats for every pitch. It shows
KISS 100%
Scalpers 0%


And youre explaining page after page the game we just watched NEVER HAPPENED. While not adding any data yourself.
Last edited by Much Too Soon on Sat Jul 24, 2021 4:31 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Mark G Etess Arena SOLD OUT!

Post by battra »

Grand Classic wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 4:17 pm
battra wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 3:54 pm
Grand Classic wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 3:37 pm I have ADD and OCD as well, so I am well aware of this struggle. Just seems odd that after many years - NOW you want to make the effort. I guess better than late than never. I wish you the best.
You assume quite a lot in this post.

I've always wanted to be better.

You wanna hear some truth?

In the past 15 months:
My mother died.
My stedpdad died
My kitten died
My FIL died on my birthday
My catalytic converter was stolen (twice)
My job was eliminated
A friend was murdered

I mean, honestly, there's more, and I just don't remember it all, and some of it I won't divulge.

But I went through absolute hell for the past year. Yeah, it really, really makes me want to be better for some reason. I'm sorry I wasn't ready before.
I am terribly sorry to hear all of that and I was being sincere when I said I wish you the best.

It is the reason why I told you that I have OCD and ADD, because I understood on that level. I could never understand what you are going through and I am truly sorry.
You know, here's another truth bomb.

I've never said what my life is really like because...before 2020, I didn't think anyone here would believe me...saying he's making things up on the internet to seem cool...and I didn't say after, because I figured folks would say I'm making things up to get sympathy.

Life always regresses to the mean.

But hey, my city is burning...so at least I'm not moving out. :)

In fairness, there's been some really good stuff to even it out a bit, but...

I'd give a lot right now to go back to 2019.
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Re: Mark G Etess Arena SOLD OUT!

Post by misterhand80 »

Grand Classic wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 1:21 pm
In the Suds wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 1:16 pm
Grand Classic wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 1:07 pm
battra wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 11:36 am You know...

I used to try to battle Nibbs over this too.

But he always comes back to the same thing.

Kiss makes more money now than they ever did.

This is either wrong or it's right. He doesn't care about X, Y, or Z...just looking at how many tickets they're selling at how much.

You can twist and turn and make the same arguments I did, but he's always gonna say the same thing... is X more than Y?

And then, because you're proud...you won't answer. You'll divert from that fact.

I look forward to watching this play out in every single thread Nibbs stars forever.
Did you recently find out that you share a love for cosplay and that's why you are Nibbler's biggest champion now after you used to call him out all the time on his bullshit? Do you feel you were wrong all those times before now?
I'm really enjoying battra's new 'reasonable guy who's above it all' guise. As if he's not one of the all time champs of tedious multi-page arguing.
Yep. He's been a big time instigator here for YEARS, which is fine - but it's fucking laughable that he's trying to come across now as the adult in the room who is above such banter and back and forth arguing.
Enjoying that someone is an instigator. What a moron.
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Re: Mark G Etess Arena SOLD OUT!

Post by Grand Classic »

misterhand80 wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 5:21 pm
Grand Classic wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 1:21 pm
In the Suds wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 1:16 pm
Grand Classic wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 1:07 pm

Did you recently find out that you share a love for cosplay and that's why you are Nibbler's biggest champion now after you used to call him out all the time on his bullshit? Do you feel you were wrong all those times before now?
I'm really enjoying battra's new 'reasonable guy who's above it all' guise. As if he's not one of the all time champs of tedious multi-page arguing.
Yep. He's been a big time instigator here for YEARS, which is fine - but it's fucking laughable that he's trying to come across now as the adult in the room who is above such banter and back and forth arguing.
Enjoying that someone is an instigator. What a moron.
You are instigating right now. Everyone does it.
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Re: Mark G Etess Arena SOLD OUT!

Post by TwistedTaste »

Dynamic Denial
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Re: Mark G Etess Arena SOLD OUT!

Post by redinthesky »

Much Too Soon wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 4:19 pm
I’ll just give you this Acorn…you are good at arguing and obfuscating….but I bet you were incapable of balancing a simple checkbook. All the data is out there for you to devour. The average ticket price, the average attendance the average gate receipts. As well as all the above per show too.

In reality folks here have provided a baseball box score complete with stats for every pitch. It shows
KISS 100%
Scalpers 0%


And youre explaining page after page the game we just watched NEVER HAPPENED. While not adding any data yourself.
Question for you Much, or anyone.

If Kiss gets an agreed-upon guarantee from the promoter, wouldn't it not matter to Kiss what any given ticket sells for? For example, that Nassau Coliseum guy I saw nail a $750 2nd-row ticket for only $250 right before showtime. I'm assuming Kiss didn't lose half a grand on the ticket. It was the promotor trying not to get zero for an unsold ticket, so he accepted $250. So if Kiss gets their guarantee anyway, unless there's something else specifically into play here, what do they care what tickets are discounted or not discounted? All they should care about is, do anything to get people in seats.

And keep it cool, I'm not here to get into a pissing match. It's a sincere question.
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Re: Mark G Etess Arena SOLD OUT!

Post by nibbler1982 »

redinthesky wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 6:41 pm
Much Too Soon wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 4:19 pm
I’ll just give you this Acorn…you are good at arguing and obfuscating….but I bet you were incapable of balancing a simple checkbook. All the data is out there for you to devour. The average ticket price, the average attendance the average gate receipts. As well as all the above per show too.

In reality folks here have provided a baseball box score complete with stats for every pitch. It shows
KISS 100%
Scalpers 0%


And youre explaining page after page the game we just watched NEVER HAPPENED. While not adding any data yourself.
Question for you Much, or anyone.

If Kiss gets an agreed-upon guarantee from the promoter, wouldn't it not matter to Kiss what any given ticket sells for? For example, that Nassau Coliseum guy I saw nail a $750 2nd-row ticket for only $250 right before showtime. I'm assuming Kiss didn't lose half a grand on the ticket. It was the promotor trying not to get zero for an unsold ticket, so he accepted $250. So if Kiss gets their guarantee anyway, unless there's something else specifically into play here, what do they care what tickets are discounted or not discounted? All they should care about is, do anything to get people in seats.

And keep it cool, I'm not here to get into a pissing match. It's a sincere question.
It’s a great question big man.

KISS probably gets a flat guarantee and a 80/20 split on all things past a certain attendance number and/or figure at the gate. It’s funny you mention the $250 steal at the wire. The Nassau Coliseum actually had the highest price per ticket average in North America. It was really a case of dynamic pricing at its finest. The current average is $106.51…the Nassau Coliseum came in at $138.15

KISS
Nassau Coliseum
Uniondale, NY
Mar. 22, 2019
$1,432,295
10,368
Ticket average: $138.15

Even if KISS is working on a flat guarantee with no points. It’s always best to get the highest gate possible for future negotiations.

The main objective of selling all the prime seats at such an exorbitant number is to squeeze out the brokers. In the old days all the first few rows were the same top end price. The scalpers bout then up and sold them die three times face value. Now that money goes to KISS (technically). They didn’t sell three $750 seats for $250…they sold fifty seven $250 seats for $750.

Dynamic pricing.
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Re: Mark G Etess Arena SOLD OUT!

Post by redinthesky »

nibbler1982 wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 7:01 pm
redinthesky wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 6:41 pm
Much Too Soon wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 4:19 pm
I’ll just give you this Acorn…you are good at arguing and obfuscating….but I bet you were incapable of balancing a simple checkbook. All the data is out there for you to devour. The average ticket price, the average attendance the average gate receipts. As well as all the above per show too.

In reality folks here have provided a baseball box score complete with stats for every pitch. It shows
KISS 100%
Scalpers 0%


And youre explaining page after page the game we just watched NEVER HAPPENED. While not adding any data yourself.
Question for you Much, or anyone.

If Kiss gets an agreed-upon guarantee from the promoter, wouldn't it not matter to Kiss what any given ticket sells for? For example, that Nassau Coliseum guy I saw nail a $750 2nd-row ticket for only $250 right before showtime. I'm assuming Kiss didn't lose half a grand on the ticket. It was the promotor trying not to get zero for an unsold ticket, so he accepted $250. So if Kiss gets their guarantee anyway, unless there's something else specifically into play here, what do they care what tickets are discounted or not discounted? All they should care about is, do anything to get people in seats.

And keep it cool, I'm not here to get into a pissing match. It's a sincere question.
It’s a great question big man.

KISS probably gets a flat guarantee and a 80/20 split on all things past a certain attendance number and/or figure at the gate. It’s funny you mention the $250 steal at the wire. The Nassau Coliseum actually had the highest price per ticket average in North America. It was really a case of dynamic pricing at its finest. The current average is $106.51…the Nassau Coliseum came in at $138.15

KISS
Nassau Coliseum
Uniondale, NY
Mar. 22, 2019
$1,432,295
10,368
Ticket average: $138.15

Even if KISS is working on a flat guarantee with no points. It’s always best to get the highest gate possible for future negotiations.

The main objective of selling all the prime seats at such an exorbitant number is to squeeze out the brokers. In the old days all the first few rows were the same top end price. The scalpers bout then up and sold them die three times face value. Now that money goes to KISS (technically). They didn’t sell three $750 seats for $250…they sold fifty seven $250 seats for $750.

Dynamic pricing.
gracias
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Re: Mark G Etess Arena SOLD OUT!

Post by SpinningAcorn »

redinthesky wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 6:41 pm
Much Too Soon wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 4:19 pm
I’ll just give you this Acorn…you are good at arguing and obfuscating….but I bet you were incapable of balancing a simple checkbook. All the data is out there for you to devour. The average ticket price, the average attendance the average gate receipts. As well as all the above per show too.

In reality folks here have provided a baseball box score complete with stats for every pitch. It shows
KISS 100%
Scalpers 0%


And youre explaining page after page the game we just watched NEVER HAPPENED. While not adding any data yourself.
Question for you Much, or anyone.

If Kiss gets an agreed-upon guarantee from the promoter, wouldn't it not matter to Kiss what any given ticket sells for? For example, that Nassau Coliseum guy I saw nail a $750 2nd-row ticket for only $250 right before showtime. I'm assuming Kiss didn't lose half a grand on the ticket. It was the promotor trying not to get zero for an unsold ticket, so he accepted $250. So if Kiss gets their guarantee anyway, unless there's something else specifically into play here, what do they care what tickets are discounted or not discounted? All they should care about is, do anything to get people in seats.

And keep it cool, I'm not here to get into a pissing match. It's a sincere question.

Of course your answer from Jot acted like Kiss gets individual guarantees each show.

Yes that applies when you're doing individual dates or a handful of dates for one promoter. It's certainly different when you own the whole tour.

The Dixie Chicks are great example. If I remember right they could have had 80% guaranteed. But instead they gambled and went with 95%. After the attack on President Bush, sales plummeted. I can't remember how many millions upon millions AEG saved by The Dixie Chicks gambling. It was a big number.

Also jot doesn't understand Dynamic pricing at all.

He's proven time and time again he knows nothing about the industry.

Just remember he thinks it's best when the show doesn't sell out to the very end even though it's a show with Dynamic pricing. To him, low demand equals more money.

Of course the split between the band and the promoter is also after allowable expenses.

Now if Kiss does really well.... they should get bonuses or points.

Also when it comes to renegotiate the next round of dates the guarantee could go up or down.
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Re: Mark G Etess Arena SOLD OUT!

Post by SpinningAcorn »


The main objective of selling all the prime seats at such an exorbitant number is to squeeze out the brokers. In the old days all the first few rows were the same top end price. The scalpers bout then up and sold them die three times face value. Now that money goes to KISS (technically). They didn’t sell three $750 seats for $250…they sold fifty seven $250 seats for $750.

Dynamic pricing.

Maybe one day this guy will learn what dynamic pricing really is ....
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Re: Mark G Etess Arena SOLD OUT!

Post by Destroyer72 »

Sphinxy the sphincter is back at the FAQ? lol
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Re: Mark G Etess Arena SOLD OUT!

Post by nibbler1982 »

Destroyer72 wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 7:41 pm Sphinxy the sphincter is back at the FAQ? lol
I call him Spininxie.

I know not his true identity.

He reminds me of an old friend.
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Re: Mark G Etess Arena SOLD OUT!

Post by Much Too Soon »

redinthesky wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 6:41 pm
Much Too Soon wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 4:19 pm
I’ll just give you this Acorn…you are good at arguing and obfuscating….but I bet you were incapable of balancing a simple checkbook. All the data is out there for you to devour. The average ticket price, the average attendance the average gate receipts. As well as all the above per show too.

In reality folks here have provided a baseball box score complete with stats for every pitch. It shows
KISS 100%
Scalpers 0%


And youre explaining page after page the game we just watched NEVER HAPPENED. While not adding any data yourself.
Question for you Much, or anyone.

If Kiss gets an agreed-upon guarantee from the promoter, wouldn't it not matter to Kiss what any given ticket sells for? For example, that Nassau Coliseum guy I saw nail a $750 2nd-row ticket for only $250 right before showtime. I'm assuming Kiss didn't lose half a grand on the ticket. It was the promotor trying not to get zero for an unsold ticket, so he accepted $250. So if Kiss gets their guarantee anyway, unless there's something else specifically into play here, what do they care what tickets are discounted or not discounted? All they should care about is, do anything to get people in seats.

And keep it cool, I'm not here to get into a pissing match. It's a sincere question.
I imagine KISS accountants know exactly what the band will pull in per show on average in the dynamic pricing environment and negotiate from strength from that perspective.

PS I’ve never had any problem with you. You’ve always been nice.
Last edited by Much Too Soon on Sat Jul 24, 2021 8:10 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Mark G Etess Arena SOLD OUT!

Post by Much Too Soon »

SpinningAcorn wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 7:35 pm
redinthesky wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 6:41 pm
Much Too Soon wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 4:19 pm
I’ll just give you this Acorn…you are good at arguing and obfuscating….but I bet you were incapable of balancing a simple checkbook. All the data is out there for you to devour. The average ticket price, the average attendance the average gate receipts. As well as all the above per show too.

In reality folks here have provided a baseball box score complete with stats for every pitch. It shows
KISS 100%
Scalpers 0%


And youre explaining page after page the game we just watched NEVER HAPPENED. While not adding any data yourself.
Question for you Much, or anyone.

If Kiss gets an agreed-upon guarantee from the promoter, wouldn't it not matter to Kiss what any given ticket sells for? For example, that Nassau Coliseum guy I saw nail a $750 2nd-row ticket for only $250 right before showtime. I'm assuming Kiss didn't lose half a grand on the ticket. It was the promotor trying not to get zero for an unsold ticket, so he accepted $250. So if Kiss gets their guarantee anyway, unless there's something else specifically into play here, what do they care what tickets are discounted or not discounted? All they should care about is, do anything to get people in seats.

And keep it cool, I'm not here to get into a pissing match. It's a sincere question.

Of course your answer from Jot acted like Kiss gets individual guarantees each show.

Yes that applies when you're doing individual dates or a handful of dates for one promoter. It's certainly different when you own the whole tour.

The Dixie Chicks are great example. If I remember right they could have had 80% guaranteed. But instead they gambled and went with 95%. After the attack on President Bush, sales plummeted. I can't remember how many millions upon millions AEG saved by The Dixie Chicks gambling. It was a big number.

Also jot doesn't understand Dynamic pricing at all.

He's proven time and time again he knows nothing about the industry.

Just remember he thinks it's best when the show doesn't sell out to the very end even though it's a show with Dynamic pricing. To him, low demand equals more money.

Of course the split between the band and the promoter is also after allowable expenses.

Now if Kiss does really well.... they should get bonuses or points.

Also when it comes to renegotiate the next round of dates the guarantee could go up or down.
Here ya go spinning bullshyt. Exactly as I’ve laid out for you from industry pros.

https://www.rollingstone.com/pro/news/t ... nd-630218/

Taylor Swift’s Ticket Strategy: Brilliant Business or Slowing Demand?
Superstars like Swift are increasingly using “dynamic pricing” that shifts ticket prices constantly like airline seats. But is it the future of the industry?


If you went on Ticketmaster in January and pulled up a third-row seat for Taylor Swift‘s June 2nd show at Chicago’s Soldier Field, it would have cost you $995. But if you looked up the same seat three months later, the price would have been $595. That’s because Swift has adopted “dynamic pricing,” where concert tickets – like airline seats – shift prices constantly in adjusting to market demand. It’s a move intended to squeeze out the secondary-ticket market – but it’s also left many fans confused as they’re asked to pay hundreds of dollars more than face value. “Basically, Ticketmaster is operating as StubHub,” says one concert-business source.


Swift is not alone. This summer, U2, Kenny Chesney, Pink, the Eagles and Shania Twain will also embrace dynamic pricing (which Ticketmaster calls Official Platinum Seats). It’s their latest attempt to battle resellers like StubHub, the eBay-owned site, which had sales of more than $1 billion in 2016. “You
 can go and buy tickets and then put them on StubHub and speculate for three to five times their face value – [that’s] their entire industry,” says Stuart Ross of Red Light Management, which reps Dave Matthews Band, Phish and more. Doc McGhee, who manages KISS, sees why Ticketmaster needed to take action: “If somebody’s going to pay $500 for a $150 ticket, the band should receive the money.”


Not everyone agrees. Some artists, like Foo Fighters and Pearl Jam, have opted out of using the dynamic-pricing model, as have smaller, indie artists like Father John Misty. “An artist like Father John Misty is very ticket-price-conscious,” says his manager, Dan Fraser. “Just because more people are willing to pay for a ticket, he doesn’t want to [charge it] … He’ll leave money on the table.”

“The industry is adopting a new mantra,” says a concert-industry expert. “If you sell out quickly, you didn’t price tickets properly.”


The program has forced promoters to rethink what a successful concert means in 2018. While Swift’s entire 2015 1989 tour sold out almost instantly, there are plenty of seats available for most of her Reputation shows. One veteran promoter says it’s selling “terribly – the worst scaling and flexible pricing I have ever seen for a stadium tour.” But others say she’s just playing a long game. “Don’t put too much emphasis on the fact she hasn’t sold out yet,” says Gary Bongiovanni, the editor-in-chief of concert trade publication Pollstar. “The industry is adopting a new mantra,” says a concert-industry expert. “If you sell out quickly, you didn’t price tickets properly.” (Swift’s representative declined to comment for the story.)
But the system can be confusing for fans. In addition to dynamic-priced tickets, Swift’s tour is offering seats on an interactive map through a menagerie of dots – yellow for VIP ($500-$900), pink for approved fan resales (which can list for thousands of dollars), blue for standard face-value tickets ($50-$450). “It’s kind of complicated,” says Alex Hodges, CEO of Nederlander Concerts in Los Angeles, suggesting that the astronomical prices may cause fans to “get skittish and back off.”
But
experts see the plan as a necessary way to hold on to profits as the entire
industry goes through a sea change. “Does the airline want to sell out all
tickets and be done with that flight?” says one source. “Or do they
want to sell them at $700 and [eventually] sell every seat? It’s that kind of
situation.” Adds another expert, “[Concert tickets] just caught up to
hotels, airfares and rental cars. It’s a cultural change and an acceptance of
resellers.”
From teenaged country tracks to synth-pop anthems to little-known covers, a comprehensive assessment, celebration of Swift’s one-of-a-kind songbook. Watch below.
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Re: Mark G Etess Arena SOLD OUT!

Post by nibbler1982 »

Much Too Soon wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 8:07 pm
SpinningAcorn wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 7:35 pm
redinthesky wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 6:41 pm
Much Too Soon wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 4:19 pm
I’ll just give you this Acorn…you are good at arguing and obfuscating….but I bet you were incapable of balancing a simple checkbook. All the data is out there for you to devour. The average ticket price, the average attendance the average gate receipts. As well as all the above per show too.

In reality folks here have provided a baseball box score complete with stats for every pitch. It shows
KISS 100%
Scalpers 0%


And youre explaining page after page the game we just watched NEVER HAPPENED. While not adding any data yourself.
Question for you Much, or anyone.

If Kiss gets an agreed-upon guarantee from the promoter, wouldn't it not matter to Kiss what any given ticket sells for? For example, that Nassau Coliseum guy I saw nail a $750 2nd-row ticket for only $250 right before showtime. I'm assuming Kiss didn't lose half a grand on the ticket. It was the promotor trying not to get zero for an unsold ticket, so he accepted $250. So if Kiss gets their guarantee anyway, unless there's something else specifically into play here, what do they care what tickets are discounted or not discounted? All they should care about is, do anything to get people in seats.

And keep it cool, I'm not here to get into a pissing match. It's a sincere question.

Of course your answer from Jot acted like Kiss gets individual guarantees each show.

Yes that applies when you're doing individual dates or a handful of dates for one promoter. It's certainly different when you own the whole tour.

The Dixie Chicks are great example. If I remember right they could have had 80% guaranteed. But instead they gambled and went with 95%. After the attack on President Bush, sales plummeted. I can't remember how many millions upon millions AEG saved by The Dixie Chicks gambling. It was a big number.

Also jot doesn't understand Dynamic pricing at all.

He's proven time and time again he knows nothing about the industry.

Just remember he thinks it's best when the show doesn't sell out to the very end even though it's a show with Dynamic pricing. To him, low demand equals more money.

Of course the split between the band and the promoter is also after allowable expenses.

Now if Kiss does really well.... they should get bonuses or points.

Also when it comes to renegotiate the next round of dates the guarantee could go up or down.
Here ya go spinning bullshyt. Exactly as I’ve laid out for you from industry pros.

https://www.rollingstone.com/pro/news/t ... nd-630218/

Taylor Swift’s Ticket Strategy: Brilliant Business or Slowing Demand?
Superstars like Swift are increasingly using “dynamic pricing” that shifts ticket prices constantly like airline seats. But is it the future of the industry?


If you went on Ticketmaster in January and pulled up a third-row seat for Taylor Swift‘s June 2nd show at Chicago’s Soldier Field, it would have cost you $995. But if you looked up the same seat three months later, the price would have been $595. That’s because Swift has adopted “dynamic pricing,” where concert tickets – like airline seats – shift prices constantly in adjusting to market demand. It’s a move intended to squeeze out the secondary-ticket market – but it’s also left many fans confused as they’re asked to pay hundreds of dollars more than face value. “Basically, Ticketmaster is operating as StubHub,” says one concert-business source.


Swift is not alone. This summer, U2, Kenny Chesney, Pink, the Eagles and Shania Twain will also embrace dynamic pricing (which Ticketmaster calls Official Platinum Seats). It’s their latest attempt to battle resellers like StubHub, the eBay-owned site, which had sales of more than $1 billion in 2016. “You
 can go and buy tickets and then put them on StubHub and speculate for three to five times their face value – [that’s] their entire industry,” says Stuart Ross of Red Light Management, which reps Dave Matthews Band, Phish and more. Doc McGhee, who manages KISS, sees why Ticketmaster needed to take action: “If somebody’s going to pay $500 for a $150 ticket, the band should receive the money.”


Not everyone agrees. Some artists, like Foo Fighters and Pearl Jam, have opted out of using the dynamic-pricing model, as have smaller, indie artists like Father John Misty. “An artist like Father John Misty is very ticket-price-conscious,” says his manager, Dan Fraser. “Just because more people are willing to pay for a ticket, he doesn’t want to [charge it] … He’ll leave money on the table.”

“The industry is adopting a new mantra,” says a concert-industry expert. “If you sell out quickly, you didn’t price tickets properly.”


The program has forced promoters to rethink what a successful concert means in 2018. While Swift’s entire 2015 1989 tour sold out almost instantly, there are plenty of seats available for most of her Reputation shows. One veteran promoter says it’s selling “terribly – the worst scaling and flexible pricing I have ever seen for a stadium tour.” But others say she’s just playing a long game. “Don’t put too much emphasis on the fact she hasn’t sold out yet,” says Gary Bongiovanni, the editor-in-chief of concert trade publication Pollstar. “The industry is adopting a new mantra,” says a concert-industry expert. “If you sell out quickly, you didn’t price tickets properly.” (Swift’s representative declined to comment for the story.)
But the system can be confusing for fans. In addition to dynamic-priced tickets, Swift’s tour is offering seats on an interactive map through a menagerie of dots – yellow for VIP ($500-$900), pink for approved fan resales (which can list for thousands of dollars), blue for standard face-value tickets ($50-$450). “It’s kind of complicated,” says Alex Hodges, CEO of Nederlander Concerts in Los Angeles, suggesting that the astronomical prices may cause fans to “get skittish and back off.”
But
experts see the plan as a necessary way to hold on to profits as the entire
industry goes through a sea change. “Does the airline want to sell out all
tickets and be done with that flight?” says one source. “Or do they
want to sell them at $700 and [eventually] sell every seat? It’s that kind of
situation.” Adds another expert, “[Concert tickets] just caught up to
hotels, airfares and rental cars. It’s a cultural change and an acceptance of
resellers.”
From teenaged country tracks to synth-pop anthems to little-known covers, a comprehensive assessment, celebration of Swift’s one-of-a-kind songbook. Watch below.
You beat me to it Brother Much.

It spells out dynamic pricing to the tee.

We described the process to a tee.

Brother Spininxie is stumbling around ham fisted in the dark.
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Re: Mark G Etess Arena SOLD OUT!

Post by redinthesky »

Much Too Soon wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 8:00 pm
redinthesky wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 6:41 pm
Much Too Soon wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 4:19 pm
I’ll just give you this Acorn…you are good at arguing and obfuscating….but I bet you were incapable of balancing a simple checkbook. All the data is out there for you to devour. The average ticket price, the average attendance the average gate receipts. As well as all the above per show too.

In reality folks here have provided a baseball box score complete with stats for every pitch. It shows
KISS 100%
Scalpers 0%


And youre explaining page after page the game we just watched NEVER HAPPENED. While not adding any data yourself.
Question for you Much, or anyone.

If Kiss gets an agreed-upon guarantee from the promoter, wouldn't it not matter to Kiss what any given ticket sells for? For example, that Nassau Coliseum guy I saw nail a $750 2nd-row ticket for only $250 right before showtime. I'm assuming Kiss didn't lose half a grand on the ticket. It was the promotor trying not to get zero for an unsold ticket, so he accepted $250. So if Kiss gets their guarantee anyway, unless there's something else specifically into play here, what do they care what tickets are discounted or not discounted? All they should care about is, do anything to get people in seats.

And keep it cool, I'm not here to get into a pissing match. It's a sincere question.
I imagine KISS accountants know exactly what the band will pull in per show on average in the dynamic pricing environment and negotiate from strength from that perspective.

PS I’ve never had any problem with you. You’ve always been nice.
Appreciated.

I'm sure many others know more about this stuff than me, all I can really say is what I see. And especially since I was deeply involved in conversing about this stuff what was it, two years ago, so I don't wanna reiterate stuff, it's exhausting. But if I see a performer I like is playing anywhere, even if I don't intend on going to the actual show, I'll see how the band or artist is doing ticket-wise out of curiosity, and see what they're charging (maybe I will go, that kind of thing). I can't speak for all shows and tours, but I can say that out of all the artists I've looked up on ticketmaster for all these years, I have never seen any ticket prices go up, only down.

I know ticketmaster says prices go by "demand" but to me that always seemed to be a way to try to get the buyer to buy now. The real meaning behind it seems to be, "Listen here possible ticket buyer, if tickets don't move out kind of quickly, we just may lower the price. But if you're not quick, you also may lose the seat. Gamble if you wish." But they won't say that, that would make too many people wait. (Of course, people are on to it now.) This is why I can't believe any band or artist would not want to sell tickets immediately. All just IMO.

It is good to see Kiss still moving tickets of course. I still suspect they have certain cards up their sleeve in the semi-near future..... 8)
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Re: Mark G Etess Arena SOLD OUT!

Post by Ghost_of_Paul_Lynde »

Big Blue Marble nostalgia alert!

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Re: Mark G Etess Arena SOLD OUT!

Post by Doose »

My understanding is KISS is paid a guarantee. Let's say it's $500k. Whether they sell 1 tickets or 10,000 tickets, KISS makes $500k.

But after the guarantee, and the promoter has covered expenses and made a certain percentage profit, the remaining profits are split with some percentage.

So if a show brings in $1,200,000, it could be:

KISS - $500,000
Promoters Expenses - $250,000
Promoter Profit - $150,000

Remaining Net: $300,000

If it's 70/30, for example, KISS gets another $210,000. So now they're $500k turned into $710,000k (not including merchandise, Meet & Greets, instruments, etc.)
Last edited by Doose on Sun Jul 25, 2021 7:42 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Mark G Etess Arena SOLD OUT!

Post by misterhand80 »

Doose wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 11:19 pm My understanding is KISS is paid a guarantee. Let's say it's $500k. Whether they sell 1 tickets or 10,000 tickets, KISS makes $500k.

But after the guarantee, and the promoter has covered expenses and made a certain percentage profit, the remaining profits are split 50/50.

So if a show brings in $1,200,000, it could be:

KISS - $500,000
Promoters Expenses - $250,000
Promoter Profit - $150,000

Remaining Net: $300,000

If it's 70/30, for example, KISS gets another $210,000. So now they're $500k turned into $710,000k (not including merchandise, Meet & Greets, instruments, etc.)
There could also be price points to meet that can garner bonuses. If they reach x amount of ticket sales, a bonus is allotted or their share is now greater. So on down the line.
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Re: Mark G Etess Arena SOLD OUT!

Post by SomethingSeemLahr »

Jot Clavin.
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