David lee roth

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Re: David lee roth

Post by Glasgow Kiss »

LordThurisaz wrote: Mon Jun 21, 2021 11:58 am
Glasgow Kiss wrote: Mon Jun 21, 2021 10:39 am Sadly, you're completely right. A large proportion of 50+ year olds will opine that there are no up and coming new bands when the truth is they've just stopped seeking them out and would prefer to inhabit I-know-what-I-like territory from here on in.

It would be a monumental waste of money for a young band to pay a buy-on for a Kiss tour. The vast majority of the crowd would be trawling the merch stands or in the bar while they were playing, and those that did catch them would be firmly of the opinion that new=shit.
Then, my suggestion to these new bands is to actually be worth seeing live, or listening to at all, for that matter. The retro fetishism that gets passed off by these hipster cosplayers as "rock" is abysmal. If I wanted to listen to a band so obviously influenced by a 70s band that they even steal their musical ideas (such as modulating from one key in the verse to this key for the chorus, etc), then chances are, I'm going to turn the shit off and move on. In fact, the 50+ are the ones who give the Greta Van Susteren's of the world a pass because rock is dead and people refuse to accept it. Kingdom Come didn't get away with being a Led Zeppelin clone, because rock was far from dead. These clowns apparently do, but apparently, rock isn't dead.

Before we tout the attendance numbers, a lot of people go and see awful "music artists" dance and monotonously drone on to a backing track, or press buttons in large numbers. It doesn't change the fact that just because a lot of people accept something -- likely because the alternatives are worse -- doesn't mean that band is good. It simply means that band is benefiting from a bar lowered so much that even dreck like Greta Van Susteren is touted as "great."

Post Malone has stated he attempted to do rock music, but found he could actually make something of himself in rap. Hey though, rock ain't dead, folks...

What a crock of shit.
I've not got an enormous amount of time for GVF...their first album was too close for comfort in the same way Kingdom Come's was in the 80s. There is - or was..I'm not sure - a band from New Jersey called the Parlor Mob who did Zep-inspired material without ever sounding like a ripoff who were much better IMO.

But I wasn't meaning the 70s revivalists per se...there's loads going on in other fields of hard rock and metal that's worth checking out...loads of worthwhile power, symphonic, prog and folk metal just as a few examples. Obviously if you're looking for unironic hair metal or whatever, well yeah...that kind of thing's dead as a dodo...Steel Panther have only made a career out of taking the piss out of it...but if you're instantly dismissing the other genres without even investigating them then you're kinda proving my point.
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Re: David lee roth

Post by LordThurisaz »

Glasgow Kiss wrote: Mon Jun 21, 2021 12:18 pm I've not got an enormous amount of time for GVF...their first album was too close for comfort in the same way Kingdom Come's was in the 80s. There is - or was..I'm not sure - a band from New Jersey called the Parlor Mob who did Zep-inspired material without ever sounding like a ripoff who were much better IMO.

But I wasn't meaning the 70s revivalists per se...there's loads going on in other fields of hard rock and metal that's worth checking out...loads of worthwhile power, symphonic, prog and folk metal just as a few examples. Obviously if you're looking for unironic hair metal or whatever, well yeah...that kind of thing's dead as a dodo...Steel Panther have only made a career out of taking the piss out of it...but if you're instantly dismissing the other genres without even investigating them then you're kinda proving my point.
From bands that are 10 years old or less? I'm not seeing much of it. In fact, Razorbitch (he truly is an absolute bitch in the most sincere form of the word) did a video about what he dubbed "new wave of traditional heavy metal," as a means of proving the doomers wrong who say that "metal is dead/dying," that is indeed very alive. "Okay, well I'll give you a few minutes to state your case..." The very itself had him pointing out himself that these bands were unoriginal cosplayers, and if he hadn't taken himself so seriously when fans called him out, I would've been CERTAIN it was satire. Fans were calling him out and saying the bands were not that great, with the obvious question of, "Why would I listen to a shitty Priest redo when I could just put on Stained Class?" So, I summarized the response to the video as well as his response to his viewers by saying he was responding by going "REEEEEEEE," and I got blocked.

Good riddance.

I'm not talking about 15, 20, 30 year old bands still putting out new music. I am referring to new bands who actually have something worth listening to, a personality of their own, and the ability to be interesting to listen to. Otherwise, you have proved my point.

If I haven't made it clear enough, retro fetishists are mostly dullard hipsters raiding the vintage clothing stores and going around like LARPers and cosplayers. Not interested. Not in the slightest.
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Re: David lee roth

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Christmas wrote: Sun Jun 20, 2021 8:05 am
ftjr1974 wrote: Thu Jun 17, 2021 5:53 pm I still say fuck DLR. I like him, don't get me wrong. But older bands like Kiss need to give younger bands a chance to get exposure. Greta Van Fleet, The Struts, Goodbye June, Rival Sons, The Treatment (who has opened for Kiss before), Pistol Day Parade, Dirty Honey and The Raven Age are all younger hungry bands. Giving these groups an opening spot for a tour that is generating attendance like EOTR has so far could help put these bands over the top with the exposure they'd get.
And many have no interest in seeing those bands.

When Treatment opened, the place was maybe 5% full.
Sadly, you may be correct which is a shame. And if I were one of these bands I definitely would not pay to play. Although convenient and easy for fans, the internet and streaming services have made the road to success nearly impossible for up and coming bands.
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Re: David lee roth

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jannep17 wrote: Fri Jun 18, 2021 11:30 pm
Lofton23rdSt wrote: Fri Jun 18, 2021 2:08 pm I don't like any of those younger bands.
Me neither. Why are young people playing old people's music? They should go into techno or something.
Lol. Techno hasn’t been a thing since the mid 90s bro. You’re twenty-five years out of touch.

Which proves the point I made on opening bands - KISS’ audience only knows the old shit. No point having a younger band on the bill.
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Re: David lee roth

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alanrosembung wrote: Mon Jun 21, 2021 3:37 pm
Lol. Techno hasn’t been a thing since the mid 90s bro. You’re twenty-five years out of touch.

Which proves the point I made on opening bands - KISS’ audience only knows the old shit. No point having a younger band on the bill.

I remember what they called "New Wave" music but it turned into a broad vague term.

A Wickpedia excerpt :

New wave is a broad music genre that encompasses numerous pop and rock styles from the late 1970s and the 1980s.[2] It was originally used as a catch-all for the music that emerged after punk rock,[21] including punk itself, but may be viewed retrospectively as a more accessible counterpart of post-punk.[22][23] Although new wave shared punk's DIY philosophy, the artists were more influenced by the lighter strains of 1960s pop while opposed to mainstream "corporate" rock, which they considered creatively stagnant, and the generally abrasive and political bents of punk rock.[3]

Common characteristics of new wave music include a humorous or quirky pop approach, the use of electronic sounds, and a distinctive visual style featured in music videos and fashion.[22][3] In the early 1980s, virtually every new pop/rock act – and particularly those that featured synthesizers in their sound – was tagged as "new wave".[22] By the 2000s, critical consensus favored "new wave" to be an umbrella term that encompassed power pop, synth-pop, ska revival, and the softer strains of punk rock.[6]

New wave peaked commercially in the late 1970s and the early 1980s with numerous major artists and an abundance of one-hit wonders. After MTV was launched in 1981, the network promoted new wave acts heavily on the channel, which gave the genre a boost in popularity.
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Re: David lee roth

Post by Christmas »

ftjr1974 wrote: Mon Jun 21, 2021 12:49 pm
Christmas wrote: Sun Jun 20, 2021 8:05 am
ftjr1974 wrote: Thu Jun 17, 2021 5:53 pm I still say fuck DLR. I like him, don't get me wrong. But older bands like Kiss need to give younger bands a chance to get exposure. Greta Van Fleet, The Struts, Goodbye June, Rival Sons, The Treatment (who has opened for Kiss before), Pistol Day Parade, Dirty Honey and The Raven Age are all younger hungry bands. Giving these groups an opening spot for a tour that is generating attendance like EOTR has so far could help put these bands over the top with the exposure they'd get.
And many have no interest in seeing those bands.

When Treatment opened, the place was maybe 5% full.
Sadly, you may be correct which is a shame. And if I were one of these bands I definitely would not pay to play. Although convenient and easy for fans, the internet and streaming services have made the road to success nearly impossible for up and coming bands.
As I thought about this, I remember my son liking Caleb Johnson in the FTR tour. And since it seems every KISS show has a decent amount of fans who have never seen Kiss before, so maybe getting a new band in there would be the right thing to do.

All that said, I did like seeing DLR.
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Re: David lee roth

Post by Terry Zeppelin »

muddfoot wrote: Kiss can’t have energetic openers anymore

GVF….they’d be great but Kiss would have trouble following that
You mean Greta Van Queef?

or

Greta Van Suck?

I don't think a Zeppelin tribute band would fly opening for a Kiss tribute band ;)
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Re: David lee roth

Post by LordThurisaz »

Terry Zeppelin wrote: Mon Jun 21, 2021 6:27 pm You mean Greta Van Queef?

or

Greta Van Suck?

I don't think a Zeppelin tribute band would fly opening for a Kiss tribute band ;)
:lol:
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Re: David lee roth

Post by jannep17 »

alanrosembung wrote: Mon Jun 21, 2021 3:37 pm
jannep17 wrote: Fri Jun 18, 2021 11:30 pm
Lofton23rdSt wrote: Fri Jun 18, 2021 2:08 pm I don't like any of those younger bands.
Me neither. Why are young people playing old people's music? They should go into techno or something.
Lol. Techno hasn’t been a thing since the mid 90s bro. You’re twenty-five years out of touch.

Which proves the point I made on opening bands - KISS’ audience only knows the old shit. No point having a younger band on the bill.
I follow the techno scene closely, and sure, the genre names have developed and many of the artists don't identify themselves as techno, but that name is still valid if you want to casually - for instance to someone not familiar with it - describe a large group of DJs/artists working with dance music today.
Last edited by jannep17 on Mon Jun 21, 2021 10:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: David lee roth

Post by ZachAttack »

ftjr1974 wrote: Thu Jun 17, 2021 5:53 pm I still say fuck DLR. I like him, don't get me wrong. But older bands like Kiss need to give younger bands a chance to get exposure. Greta Van Fleet, The Struts, Goodbye June, Rival Sons, The Treatment (who has opened for Kiss before), Pistol Day Parade, Dirty Honey and The Raven Age are all younger hungry bands. Giving these groups an opening spot for a tour that is generating attendance like EOTR has so far could help put these bands over the top with the exposure they'd get.

Touring hasn't worked like that since the 90s. You pay for your band to open for major acts. Young bands can't afford that.
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Re: David lee roth

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LordThurisaz wrote: Mon Jun 21, 2021 12:27 pm
From bands that are 10 years old or less? I'm not seeing much of it. In fact, Razorbitch (he truly is an absolute bitch in the most sincere form of the word) did a video about what he dubbed "new wave of traditional heavy metal," as a means of proving the doomers wrong who say that "metal is dead/dying," that is indeed very alive. "Okay, well I'll give you a few minutes to state your case..." The very itself had him pointing out himself that these bands were unoriginal cosplayers, and if he hadn't taken himself so seriously when fans called him out, I would've been CERTAIN it was satire. Fans were calling him out and saying the bands were not that great, with the obvious question of, "Why would I listen to a shitty Priest redo when I could just put on Stained Class?" So, I summarized the response to the video as well as his response to his viewers by saying he was responding by going "REEEEEEEE," and I got blocked.

Good riddance.

I'm not talking about 15, 20, 30 year old bands still putting out new music. I am referring to new bands who actually have something worth listening to, a personality of their own, and the ability to be interesting to listen to. Otherwise, you have proved my point.

If I haven't made it clear enough, retro fetishists are mostly dullard hipsters raiding the vintage clothing stores and going around like LARPers and cosplayers. Not interested. Not in the slightest.

I love how people bring up Foo Fighters with this argument like they're some "new" band lol

Take it from someone who was actually in one of the origin NWOTHM bands - it's dead.

You know the scene in the Anvil movie where they're playing a bar and there's like one guy in the audience sitting in a recliner? That's like 90% of all shows in the US...and that's even when we would tour with an established 80s metal band. The only thing keeping it hanging on are these big festivals where Priest or someone huge headlines...and once all those old bands retire and you don't have the marquee name to bring people in, you can say goodbye to rock music forever
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Re: David lee roth

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LordThurisaz wrote: Mon Jun 21, 2021 12:27 pm
Glasgow Kiss wrote: Mon Jun 21, 2021 12:18 pm I've not got an enormous amount of time for GVF...their first album was too close for comfort in the same way Kingdom Come's was in the 80s. There is - or was..I'm not sure - a band from New Jersey called the Parlor Mob who did Zep-inspired material without ever sounding like a ripoff who were much better IMO.

But I wasn't meaning the 70s revivalists per se...there's loads going on in other fields of hard rock and metal that's worth checking out...loads of worthwhile power, symphonic, prog and folk metal just as a few examples. Obviously if you're looking for unironic hair metal or whatever, well yeah...that kind of thing's dead as a dodo...Steel Panther have only made a career out of taking the piss out of it...but if you're instantly dismissing the other genres without even investigating them then you're kinda proving my point.
From bands that are 10 years old or less? I'm not seeing much of it. In fact, Razorbitch (he truly is an absolute bitch in the most sincere form of the word) did a video about what he dubbed "new wave of traditional heavy metal," as a means of proving the doomers wrong who say that "metal is dead/dying," that is indeed very alive. "Okay, well I'll give you a few minutes to state your case..." The very itself had him pointing out himself that these bands were unoriginal cosplayers, and if he hadn't taken himself so seriously when fans called him out, I would've been CERTAIN it was satire. Fans were calling him out and saying the bands were not that great, with the obvious question of, "Why would I listen to a shitty Priest redo when I could just put on Stained Class?" So, I summarized the response to the video as well as his response to his viewers by saying he was responding by going "REEEEEEEE," and I got blocked.

Good riddance.

I'm not talking about 15, 20, 30 year old bands still putting out new music. I am referring to new bands who actually have something worth listening to, a personality of their own, and the ability to be interesting to listen to. Otherwise, you have proved my point.

If I haven't made it clear enough, retro fetishists are mostly dullard hipsters raiding the vintage clothing stores and going around like LARPers and cosplayers. Not interested. Not in the slightest.
The reality is that everything has been done.

You are not going to see a new band come out of nowhere with a style of their own that is going to light the world on fire at a time when the younger generation for the most part doesn't care about music in the same way as generations before.

Music is disposable for the most part. They listen, go crazy for a latest song and then move on. I know you are younger - you would be among the exception.

A record label is better off appealing to an older demographic that still is passionate about music and will still buy albums on a somewhat regular basis, so that is why there are tons of retro classic rock bands. Many who do very well in this day and age. 40 and 50+ year old people tend to just want to hear the kind of music that they grew up with. They are past the point of desiring some kind of avant garde rock music that no one has heard before. You are not there yet, even though I am ironically talking to you on a forum for a 50 year old band.

If Wolfgang's new album did sound exactly like Van Halen - VH fans would be jerking off to it and thanking their personal God that there will be more Van Halen style music coming.

You also have to consider that some millennials did listen to Zeppelin and other classic rock bands growing up, so like all other bands in any other decade, it was natural for them to want to play that style of music once they started their own band.

Love or hate GVF, they are successful because of classic rock. They wouldn't be anything if they were going for a completely new sound. It is unfortunate, but that is reality.
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Re: David lee roth

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ZachAttack wrote: Mon Jun 21, 2021 10:07 pm ...and once all those old bands retire and you don't have the marquee name to bring people in, you can say goodbye to rock music forever
True, it would be like someone expecting Big Band Music to come back again and be in style.
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Re: David lee roth

Post by LordThurisaz »

ZachAttack wrote: Mon Jun 21, 2021 10:07 pm I love how people bring up Foo Fighters with this argument like they're some "new" band lol

Take it from someone who was actually in one of the origin NWOTHM bands - it's dead.

You know the scene in the Anvil movie where they're playing a bar and there's like one guy in the audience sitting in a recliner? That's like 90% of all shows in the US...and that's even when we would tour with an established 80s metal band. The only thing keeping it hanging on are these big festivals where Priest or someone huge headlines...and once all those old bands retire and you don't have the marquee name to bring people in, you can say goodbye to rock music forever
Who brings up the Foo Fighters?

All you have to do is look at the B level bands, and see the vast divide between them and the A level bands. Ticket and album sales are steep between these two levels, and the C, D, etc. levels are even worse. Metal has always been a bit of a niche subset of Rock, but for a time, it had an audience at least. Now it doesn't have much of jack shit. The double whammy of the 90s of depressing, dreary grunge / alternative steeped in 70s accoutrements, both musically and visually, followed by shameless elderly bands reuniting for a huge pay day really killed off rock. For metal, it was the extremism, appealing to smaller and smaller audiences, and in the mainstream, the death of guitar solos (ie, nu metal), that basically assured its demise. The sampled, triggered drums didn't help matters any, nor did extreme bands weirdly trying to move up from the underground. Labels saw Earache, Roadrunner, et al, and thought they could somehow make a fortune in much the same way they did with every other previous subgenre movement. I'm pretty certain every such attempt was a complete and utter failure.

For those music listeners who basically wanted fun party music, they got it elsewhere, typically in the form of Disco's bastard offspring, whatever you want to call it. (ie, rap/hip hop, dance, electro, techno, house, etc.)
Grand Classic wrote: Mon Jun 21, 2021 10:46 pm The reality is that everything has been done.

You are not going to see a new band come out of nowhere with a style of their own that is going to light the world on fire at a time when the younger generation for the most part doesn't care about music in the same way as generations before.

Music is disposable for the most part. They listen, go crazy for a latest song and then move on. I know you are younger - you would be among the exception.

A record label is better off appealing to an older demographic that still is passionate about music and will still buy albums on a somewhat regular basis, so that is why there are tons of retro classic rock bands. Many who do very well in this day and age. 40 and 50+ year old people tend to just want to hear the kind of music that they grew up with. They are past the point of desiring some kind of avant garde rock music that no one has heard before. You are not there yet, even though I am ironically talking to you on a forum for a 50 year old band.

If Wolfgang's new album did sound exactly like Van Halen - VH fans would be jerking off to it and thanking their personal God that there will be more Van Halen style music coming.

You also have to consider that some millennials did listen to Zeppelin and other classic rock bands growing up, so like all other bands in any other decade, it was natural for them to want to play that style of music once they started their own band.

Love or hate GVF, they are successful because of classic rock. They wouldn't be anything if they were going for a completely new sound. It is unfortunate, but that is reality.
Younger generations do not care about music in the same way as before, I agree. I think much of that has to do with information overload and option paralysis, thanks to the internet. You don't grow and absorb music in the same way you did previously, because there are always 5 other things you want to go watch, listen to, etc. While everything has been done, everything had been done by the 70s, and yet we still had quite a few interesting acts spring up afterwards. The issue for a lot of recent rock and metal bands is they do not care to actually be unique, and thanks to Scream, think being "meta" and cynical is good enough.

Case in point: The so called "thrash revival" was very short lived because there were far too many acts where they were leaning far too heavily on incredibly "stock" -- shall we say -- Metallica, Exodus, Megadeth, and Slayer riffs. I think the courts, however, would argue that they were stolen, but I doubt the bands that were plagiarized would get much from going after these creatively bankrupt thieves.

I liked Wolfgang's new album, and I'm glad he didn't just "write" some songs that may or may not have been just like dear old Dad's, with dubious origins. "Oh, uh, yeah, I may have gotten that from a demo and 'reimagined' it." That said, the older generation seems to pine so much for their youth, thanks to nostalgia (the death of creativity, as far as I am concerned; fuck nostalgia), that they are very accepting of prepackaged plagiarism. This is what happens when you are starved of new films, shows, music, etc. that appeal to your tastes, but remember: "rock is not dead." Give me a break.

I just hope these lazy hipster douches do not start ripping off Thin Lizzy. Then again, I think that'd be a little too high effort for these slackjawed dimwits. The difference between today's bands and those from previous generations is the number of influences each member brings to the table. Bands of the past even had different genre influences; bands of today might have 3 musical influences among them, and think it is "clever" to mix AC/DC with 80s New Wave. Actually, come to think of it, I think that is a bit too high effort for most of these retro fetishist weirdos.

It'll be short lived when GVF's demographic dies off in the next ten to fifteen years. Then what?
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Re: David lee roth

Post by ZachAttack »

LordThurisaz wrote: Tue Jun 22, 2021 9:47 am
Who brings up the Foo Fighters?
They are always the go-to band I hear people bring up when they are asked "name one new rock band that is successful", as if they just started 5 years ago

Then I also always hear about how either GnR or AC/DC "just sold out the arena here!"
LordThurisaz wrote: Tue Jun 22, 2021 9:47 am
I just hope these lazy hipster douches do not start ripping off Thin Lizzy. Then again, I think that'd be a little too high effort for these slackjawed dimwits. The difference between today's bands and those from previous generations is the number of influences each member brings to the table. Bands of the past even had different genre influences; bands of today might have 3 musical influences among them, and think it is "clever" to mix AC/DC with 80s New Wave. Actually, come to think of it, I think that is a bit too high effort for most of these retro fetishist weirdos.
Thin Lizzy is probably too complicated to emulate. Pretty much every single young metal band is described as "Venom/Motorhead worship". It's just the same shit over and over. They don't realize that bands like Motorhead had influences dating back decades to shit like Little Richard and the beginnings of Rock N Roll. Sometime in the 90s the US began this whole "throw away" culture where anything older than like 5 years was considered out of date and worthless. This is why millennials or Gen Z or whatever the hell they're called, don't seem to have knowledge of anything that happened more than 10-20 years ago (which Gene has actually pointed out in interviews several times). So now you have generations of musicians whose influences barely date back to grunge music and nothing else. When you listened to someone like KISS, it was an amalgamation of EVERYTHING that came before them, from Chubby Checker to Zeppelin.
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Re: David lee roth

Post by Glasgow Kiss »

ZachAttack wrote: Tue Jun 22, 2021 10:00 am
LordThurisaz wrote: Tue Jun 22, 2021 9:47 am
Who brings up the Foo Fighters?
They are always the go-to band I hear people bring up when they are asked "name one new rock band that is successful", as if they just started 5 years ago

Then I also always hear about how either GnR or AC/DC "just sold out the arena here!"
LordThurisaz wrote: Tue Jun 22, 2021 9:47 am
I just hope these lazy hipster douches do not start ripping off Thin Lizzy. Then again, I think that'd be a little too high effort for these slackjawed dimwits. The difference between today's bands and those from previous generations is the number of influences each member brings to the table. Bands of the past even had different genre influences; bands of today might have 3 musical influences among them, and think it is "clever" to mix AC/DC with 80s New Wave. Actually, come to think of it, I think that is a bit too high effort for most of these retro fetishist weirdos.
Thin Lizzy is probably too complicated to emulate. Pretty much every single young metal band is described as "Venom/Motorhead worship". It's just the same shit over and over. They don't realize that bands like Motorhead had influences dating back decades to shit like Little Richard and the beginnings of Rock N Roll. Sometime in the 90s the US began this whole "throw away" culture where anything older than like 5 years was considered out of date and worthless. This is why millennials or Gen Z or whatever the hell they're called, don't seem to have knowledge of anything that happened more than 10-20 years ago (which Gene has actually pointed out in interviews several times). So now you have generations of musicians whose influences barely date back to grunge music and nothing else. When you listened to someone like KISS, it was an amalgamation of EVERYTHING that came before them, from Chubby Checker to Zeppelin.
This lot do a fair approximation of Thin Lizzy:

https://youtu.be/adovIrzG9L0

To be fair, I think part of it is just down to being Irish rather than a conscious ripoff...a lot of young musicians there will grow up playing traditional stuff. Go into a lot of bars there especially out in culchie country and there'll be a group of guys in the corner playing acoustic stuff that has that general tonality and rhythmic sensibility.
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Re: David lee roth

Post by LordThurisaz »

ZachAttack wrote: Tue Jun 22, 2021 10:00 am They are always the go-to band I hear people bring up when they are asked "name one new rock band that is successful", as if they just started 5 years ago

Then I also always hear about how either GnR or AC/DC "just sold out the arena here!"
Ah, okay. Foo Fighters first album was, what, 25 years ago?

As if AC/DC, GnR, or other similar tier acts are the rule, and not the exception. I would hope that a heritage act playing a greatest hits setlist would be able to fill up something, because otherwise, yikes.
ZachAttack wrote: Tue Jun 22, 2021 10:00 am Thin Lizzy is probably too complicated to emulate. Pretty much every single young metal band is described as "Venom/Motorhead worship". It's just the same shit over and over. They don't realize that bands like Motorhead had influences dating back decades to shit like Little Richard and the beginnings of Rock N Roll. Sometime in the 90s the US began this whole "throw away" culture where anything older than like 5 years was considered out of date and worthless. This is why millennials or Gen Z or whatever the hell they're called, don't seem to have knowledge of anything that happened more than 10-20 years ago (which Gene has actually pointed out in interviews several times). So now you have generations of musicians whose influences barely date back to grunge music and nothing else. When you listened to someone like KISS, it was an amalgamation of EVERYTHING that came before them, from Chubby Checker to Zeppelin.
Venom and Motorhead aren't too far off from each other, either. Lyrically, sure, and musically, they do have their differences, but it is sorta like chocolate chip cookies and oatmeal chocolate chip cookies: sort of different, but basically the same idea. I think the cynical ideas of meta (thanks to Scream) have really tainted any "creativity" that Gen Z, Zoomers, Millennials, etc. might have. They still haven't mastered the idea of, "stealing from one source is plagiarism; stealing from a multitude of sources is research." They also seem to have difficulty mastering the idea of stealing something from x and putting it in y. For instance, if you steal something from a funk band, and put it in a metal context, suddenly you sound "brilliant" and "unique; a true innovator." Most of them think that if they take very bland, obvious influence rip off idea from A genre, very bland, obvious influence rip off idea from B genre, and mash them together haphazardly, they have somehow been "creative." It isn't creative to take a worn out pair of musical shoes from blues rock and smash it into a very cliche, stock hip hop beat; it is lazy, poorly thought out, and ultimately doesn't know what it wants to be.

As they say, you can't buy a personality, and it seems that LARPers and cosplayers believe they can borrow someone else's. Unfortunately -- both for them and us -- you cannot.

"Throw away culture" -- also known as flavor of the month / day / hour / minute -- has been a thing for awhile, prior to the 90s. However, the knowledge of history still applied and was still known by the artist. I think it really went into warp speed when technology, the internet, and the need to stay "trendy" (barf) became all anyone cared about to such a degree that after awhile, they valued nothing, but outside validation. In the process, they no longer had life experience (and who wants to listen to you if you are basically a vapid, empty vessel), zero personality, and nothing of importance to say. You can see this shit in Millennial / Gen Z written, produced, and directed films as well. They do not know how to make likable characters (partially because they are so hellbent on self insertion, and they are detestable creatures themselves), and they fail to create compelling stories, adventures, journeys, whatever in a manner where the film feels worth the time to watch. More than that, though, they absolutely have no clue how to write a finish (you wrestling fans know what that means), in such a way where it gets over with the audience and feels fulfilling, enjoyable, or etc. Instead, they force their bullshit finish and you're left going, "Wow. Acts I and II were swell, but that last act was a total clusterfuck of failure."
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Re: David lee roth

Post by Sweet Pain »

Well is David still opening up this KISS tour next month or not?

Why is David's name only listed on Ticketmaster for 3 shows?

One of his 2020 guitarists, Frank Lindia, has now recenty joind RATT. The blabbermouth article labelled his as " Former David Lee Roth guitarist"

Why is there no recent publicity about DLR on the KISS tour set to resume August 18 in Mansfield?

These are my questions.

It'd be nice if there were at least one or two comments relating to the actual topic headline.

No offence or disrespect to anyone at all but for me reading this entire thread was torture. Honest to God torture. I don't give a f*%k about Greta Van Fleet.

I was just clicking & reading hoping for some insight & confirmation about DLR still being the opening act or not. The Ticketmaster listings are what is confusing. His name was there before on all shows. But now only 3. What is the deal with that?
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Re: David lee roth

Post by Grand Classic »

Sweet Pain wrote: Sun Jul 04, 2021 7:39 pm Well is David still opening up this KISS tour next month or not?

Why is David's name only listed on Ticketmaster for 3 shows?

One of his 2020 guitarists, Frank Lindia, has now recenty joind RATT. The blabbermouth article labelled his as " Former David Lee Roth guitarist"

Why is there no recent publicity about DLR on the KISS tour set to resume August 18 in Mansfield?

These are my questions.

It'd be nice if there were at least one or two comments relating to the actual topic headline.

No offence or disrespect to anyone at all but for me reading this entire thread was torture. Honest to God torture. I don't give a f*%k about Greta Van Fleet.

I was just clicking & reading hoping for some insight & confirmation about DLR still being the opening act or not. The Ticketmaster listings are what is confusing. His name was there before on all shows. But now only 3. What is the deal with that?
You are probably better off going to the VH forum:

https://www.vhlinks.com/vbforums/thread ... ost2456305
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Re: David lee roth

Post by DonnaDixon »

Bruce wrote: Thu Jun 17, 2021 6:00 pm Dave's voice is as shot as Stanley's, thats why he's allowed to open, along with name recognition. A young 'hungry' band isn't an available option. I wish it were, it would be great to see, but Paul can't be seen following up acts that make him look bad.
Quite the full-circle irony there. Gene and Paul love (and rightly so!) to brag about how back in the day they couldn't get opener slots because no one wanted KISS showing them up.
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Re: David lee roth

Post by DonnaDixon »

Sweet Pain wrote: Sun Jul 04, 2021 7:39 pm Well is David still opening up this KISS tour next month or not?

Why is David's name only listed on Ticketmaster for 3 shows?

One of his 2020 guitarists, Frank Lindia, has now recenty joind RATT. The blabbermouth article labelled his as " Former David Lee Roth guitarist"

Why is there no recent publicity about DLR on the KISS tour set to resume August 18 in Mansfield?

These are my questions.

It'd be nice if there were at least one or two comments relating to the actual topic headline.

No offence or disrespect to anyone at all but for me reading this entire thread was torture. Honest to God torture. I don't give a f*%k about Greta Van Fleet.

I was just clicking & reading hoping for some insight & confirmation about DLR still being the opening act or not. The Ticketmaster listings are what is confusing. His name was there before on all shows. But now only 3. What is the deal with that?
I can't stand Greta.
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Re: David lee roth

Post by JupiterJones »

LordThurisaz wrote: Tue Jun 22, 2021 11:47 am
Venom and Motorhead aren't too far off from each other, either. Lyrically, sure, and musically, they do have their differences, but it is sorta like chocolate chip cookies and oatmeal chocolate chip cookies: sort of different, but basically the same idea. I think the cynical ideas of meta (thanks to Scream) have really tainted any "creativity" that Gen Z, Zoomers, Millennials, etc. might have. They still haven't mastered the idea of, "stealing from one source is plagiarism; stealing from a multitude of sources is research." They also seem to have difficulty mastering the idea of stealing something from x and putting it in y. For instance, if you steal something from a funk band, and put it in a metal context, suddenly you sound "brilliant" and "unique; a true innovator." Most of them think that if they take very bland, obvious influence rip off idea from A genre, very bland, obvious influence rip off idea from B genre, and mash them together haphazardly, they have somehow been "creative." It isn't creative to take a worn out pair of musical shoes from blues rock and smash it into a very cliche, stock hip hop beat; it is lazy, poorly thought out, and ultimately doesn't know what it wants to be.

As they say, you can't buy a personality, and it seems that LARPers and cosplayers believe they can borrow someone else's. Unfortunately -- both for them and us -- you cannot.

"Throw away culture" -- also known as flavor of the month / day / hour / minute -- has been a thing for awhile, prior to the 90s. However, the knowledge of history still applied and was still known by the artist. I think it really went into warp speed when technology, the internet, and the need to stay "trendy" (barf) became all anyone cared about to such a degree that after awhile, they valued nothing, but outside validation. In the process, they no longer had life experience (and who wants to listen to you if you are basically a vapid, empty vessel), zero personality, and nothing of importance to say. You can see this shit in Millennial / Gen Z written, produced, and directed films as well. They do not know how to make likable characters (partially because they are so hellbent on self insertion, and they are detestable creatures themselves), and they fail to create compelling stories, adventures, journeys, whatever in a manner where the film feels worth the time to watch. More than that, though, they absolutely have no clue how to write a finish (you wrestling fans know what that means), in such a way where it gets over with the audience and feels fulfilling, enjoyable, or etc. Instead, they force their bullshit finish and you're left going, "Wow. Acts I and II were swell, but that last act was a total clusterfuck of failure."
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Re: David lee roth

Post by Sweet Pain »

Grand Classic wrote: Sun Jul 04, 2021 7:54 pm
Sweet Pain wrote: Sun Jul 04, 2021 7:39 pm Well is David still opening up this KISS tour next month or not?

Why is David's name only listed on Ticketmaster for 3 shows?

One of his 2020 guitarists, Frank Lindia, has now recenty joind RATT. The blabbermouth article labelled his as " Former David Lee Roth guitarist"

Why is there no recent publicity about DLR on the KISS tour set to resume August 18 in Mansfield?

These are my questions.

It'd be nice if there were at least one or two comments relating to the actual topic headline.

No offence or disrespect to anyone at all but for me reading this entire thread was torture. Honest to God torture. I don't give a f*%k about Greta Van Fleet.

I was just clicking & reading hoping for some insight & confirmation about DLR still being the opening act or not. The Ticketmaster listings are what is confusing. His name was there before on all shows. But now only 3. What is the deal with that?
You are probably better off going to the VH forum:

https://www.vhlinks.com/vbforums/thread ... ost2456305

Thanks. I appreciate you taking the time to answer & post the link. But I'm already on there too & there's no solid confirmation. Thanks again.
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Re: David lee roth

Post by Bruce »

DonnaDixon wrote: Sun Jul 04, 2021 8:03 pm Quite the full-circle irony there. Gene and Paul love (and rightly so!) to brag about how back in the day they couldn't get opener slots because no one wanted KISS showing them up.
Agreed! KIϟϟ has much to cover up, to divert attention from and to avoid, altogether, in order to keep up appearances. With all of the overhead costs KIϟϟ has, I'm amazed that they still see the kind of money that they do. And I noticed that you are new to the forum, Donna -- thanks for adding your fresh views and insight to the discussion! When it comes to KIϟϟ, there remains a lot of ground to cover ...
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Re: David lee roth

Post by Forevertj »

I love Kiss, but making someone pay to play on tour with them is bullsh*t. No way would I do that to anybody. EVER.
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Re: David lee roth

Post by Forevertj »

nibbler1982 wrote: Sat Jun 19, 2021 8:47 am
EasyCatMan wrote: Sat Jun 19, 2021 8:33 am
Thayerscomet wrote: Thu Jun 17, 2021 3:47 pm Hi Nibs ..Frehleys comet had one when they opened for maiden in 1988 John Reagan told me personally.. its pretty standard for big names or people who have been around awhile

Nope, you've got it wrong. Frehley's Comet had to bail on that tour. Second Sighting wasn't selling at all. Megaforce wouldn't give them extra tour support money and with so many Maiden dates getting cancelled and them not getting a dime, they had to bail.


As John Regan pointed out in this interview but there's been many other stories on it:

Iron Maiden left a bad taste, because they were constantly canceling their shows, and the way that Ace‘s alleged business people crafted the contract, we did NOT get paid when they canceled! That led us to having to pull out of that tour. It was very unfortunate, and Ace took the brunt of the blame, although he and we were ready, willing and able to play every show.”

https://sleazeroxx.com/bassist-john-reg ... n-in-1988/


and Tod also backs that up. And yes, I know there's a typo in there. It should say 1988 not 1998

Sleaze Roxx: So when did things begin to go south with Frehley's Comet?

Tod Howarth: We ran out of money on the Iron Maiden tour. We were broke. We had to go home to reassess what we were going to do next. Around the middle of 1998 (1988 really), it was brought to my attention that I wouldn't be on the album and that Ace would be writing and singing all the songs.

There's several things wrong with that statement which I won't get into here. In the music industry, you make money from publishing, merchandising and touring if you're in a big enough band. Well, if I don't have any of those three, I don't have an income. How am I supposed to survive? I have heard this millions of times - "Oh, Ace fired Tod." Listen, Ace didn't fire Tod - Tod quit! There was no future for me there so I had to bow out. So after many attempts, I secured a solo deal though Simmons Records, oddly enough. It was right as the grunge thing was coming along so I got my ass kicked there. I was dropped and here comes Nirvana! [laughs]

https://www.antimusic.com/news/16/May/t ... omet.shtml


Tod on $Immons Records. Gene could sure "pick em"
Exquisite due diligence Brother Cat.

It’s really a shame Ace has been plagued trying to turn a dollar right from the start. He had to pull the plug on the Alice Cooper tour for the same reason. Unfortunately for him things have only gotten worse in recent years.

Like it’s any wonder he’s been literally begging for his old job back for years.


Is Ace not on tour with Alice now?
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Re: David lee roth

Post by rwgriffith »

Ace is about to start a new tour with Alice. He was on one before in the late 80's, too...
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Re: David lee roth

Post by JupiterJones »

Ace toured with Alice Cooper in 2017.
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Re: David lee roth

Post by Mackemkiss »

On the one hand - a lot of the posts on this thread are a bit 'get off my lawn you pesky young people!'
On the other hand - I think a lot of the classic music we love came out of teenage boredom...striving for something ...nobody's ever bored now with a mobile phone.
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Re: David lee roth

Post by DonnaDixon »

Bruce wrote: Sun Jul 04, 2021 11:01 pm
DonnaDixon wrote: Sun Jul 04, 2021 8:03 pm Quite the full-circle irony there. Gene and Paul love (and rightly so!) to brag about how back in the day they couldn't get opener slots because no one wanted KISS showing them up.
Agreed! KIϟϟ has much to cover up, to divert attention from and to avoid, altogether, in order to keep up appearances. With all of the overhead costs KIϟϟ has, I'm amazed that they still see the kind of money that they do. And I noticed that you are new to the forum, Donna -- thanks for adding your fresh views and insight to the discussion! When it comes to KIϟϟ, there remains a lot of ground to cover ...
Thanks Bruce! Is your name Bruce, or do you just love the Kulick years?

Good points. Well, KISS is really just a big corporation, and what you describe is unfortunately exactly what corporations do: cover up, to divert attention from and to avoid, altogether, in order to keep up appearances.
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Re: David lee roth

Post by DonnaDixon »

Mackemkiss wrote: Mon Jul 05, 2021 12:44 am On the one hand - a lot of the posts on this thread are a bit 'get off my lawn you pesky young people!'
On the other hand - I think a lot of the classic music we love came out of teenage boredom...striving for something ...nobody's ever bored now with a mobile phone.
Great insight there! Boredom is kind of gone now. And that's probably ironically a really bad thing.
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Re: David lee roth

Post by AxlisKing »

The Struts and Dirty Honey are fantastic!
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Re: David lee roth

Post by Bruce »

DonnaDixon wrote: Mon Jul 05, 2021 8:14 am Is your name Bruce, or do you just love the Kulick years?
There isn't even a letter 'B' in my full name! No, I just love the Kulick years. Further, I consider Bruce to be my Guitar Hero -- whatever that might mean, or be worth, coming from a mere hobby guitarist ...
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Re: David lee roth

Post by DonnaDixon »

Bruce wrote: Mon Jul 05, 2021 11:27 am
DonnaDixon wrote: Mon Jul 05, 2021 8:14 am Is your name Bruce, or do you just love the Kulick years?
There isn't even a letter 'B' in my full name! No, I just love the Kulick years. Further, I consider Bruce to be my Guitar Hero -- whatever that might mean, or be worth, coming from a mere hobby guitarist ...
What would you say are Bruce's finest moments?
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Re: David lee roth

Post by KF73 »

JupiterJones wrote: Sun Jul 04, 2021 11:23 pm Ace toured with Alice Cooper in 2017.
He also toured with Alice in 1987.
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Re: David lee roth

Post by nibbler1982 »

Forevertj wrote: Sun Jul 04, 2021 11:13 pm
nibbler1982 wrote: Sat Jun 19, 2021 8:47 am
EasyCatMan wrote: Sat Jun 19, 2021 8:33 am
Thayerscomet wrote: Thu Jun 17, 2021 3:47 pm Hi Nibs ..Frehleys comet had one when they opened for maiden in 1988 John Reagan told me personally.. its pretty standard for big names or people who have been around awhile

Nope, you've got it wrong. Frehley's Comet had to bail on that tour. Second Sighting wasn't selling at all. Megaforce wouldn't give them extra tour support money and with so many Maiden dates getting cancelled and them not getting a dime, they had to bail.


As John Regan pointed out in this interview but there's been many other stories on it:

Iron Maiden left a bad taste, because they were constantly canceling their shows, and the way that Ace‘s alleged business people crafted the contract, we did NOT get paid when they canceled! That led us to having to pull out of that tour. It was very unfortunate, and Ace took the brunt of the blame, although he and we were ready, willing and able to play every show.”

https://sleazeroxx.com/bassist-john-reg ... n-in-1988/


and Tod also backs that up. And yes, I know there's a typo in there. It should say 1988 not 1998

Sleaze Roxx: So when did things begin to go south with Frehley's Comet?

Tod Howarth: We ran out of money on the Iron Maiden tour. We were broke. We had to go home to reassess what we were going to do next. Around the middle of 1998 (1988 really), it was brought to my attention that I wouldn't be on the album and that Ace would be writing and singing all the songs.

There's several things wrong with that statement which I won't get into here. In the music industry, you make money from publishing, merchandising and touring if you're in a big enough band. Well, if I don't have any of those three, I don't have an income. How am I supposed to survive? I have heard this millions of times - "Oh, Ace fired Tod." Listen, Ace didn't fire Tod - Tod quit! There was no future for me there so I had to bow out. So after many attempts, I secured a solo deal though Simmons Records, oddly enough. It was right as the grunge thing was coming along so I got my ass kicked there. I was dropped and here comes Nirvana! [laughs]

https://www.antimusic.com/news/16/May/t ... omet.shtml


Tod on $Immons Records. Gene could sure "pick em"
Exquisite due diligence Brother Cat.

It’s really a shame Ace has been plagued trying to turn a dollar right from the start. He had to pull the plug on the Alice Cooper tour for the same reason. Unfortunately for him things have only gotten worse in recent years.

Like it’s any wonder he’s been literally begging for his old job back for years.


Is Ace not on tour with Alice now?
I was referring to how he had to cut the tour short opening for Alice in 1987 after the RPI Field House concert. Ace was LOSING money being out on tour. It was his first real year as a solo act and Ace had problems making money from the start. A theme that’s plagued him his whole career.

On a side note…the RPI is a lovely venue. A true arena that holds about 5,000. I took the ride up back in ‘89 for WCW’s New York Knockout, Clash is Champions. I was high as a kite the whole drive up, during the show, and the ride home.

Ahh those 80’s were certainly a lot of fun. :D
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Re: David lee roth

Post by DonnaDixon »

EasyCatMan wrote: Sat Jun 19, 2021 8:33 am
Thayerscomet wrote: Thu Jun 17, 2021 3:47 pm Hi Nibs ..Frehleys comet had one when they opened for maiden in 1988 John Reagan told me personally.. its pretty standard for big names or people who have been around awhile

Nope, you've got it wrong. Frehley's Comet had to bail on that tour. Second Sighting wasn't selling at all. Megaforce wouldn't give them extra tour support money and with so many Maiden dates getting cancelled and them not getting a dime, they had to bail.


As John Regan pointed out in this interview but there's been many other stories on it:

Iron Maiden left a bad taste, because they were constantly canceling their shows, and the way that Ace‘s alleged business people crafted the contract, we did NOT get paid when they canceled! That led us to having to pull out of that tour. It was very unfortunate, and Ace took the brunt of the blame, although he and we were ready, willing and able to play every show.”

https://sleazeroxx.com/bassist-john-reg ... n-in-1988/


and Tod also backs that up. And yes, I know there's a typo in there. It should say 1988 not 1998

Sleaze Roxx: So when did things begin to go south with Frehley's Comet?

Tod Howarth: We ran out of money on the Iron Maiden tour. We were broke. We had to go home to reassess what we were going to do next. Around the middle of 1998 (1988 really), it was brought to my attention that I wouldn't be on the album and that Ace would be writing and singing all the songs.

There's several things wrong with that statement which I won't get into here. In the music industry, you make money from publishing, merchandising and touring if you're in a big enough band. Well, if I don't have any of those three, I don't have an income. How am I supposed to survive? I have heard this millions of times - "Oh, Ace fired Tod." Listen, Ace didn't fire Tod - Tod quit! There was no future for me there so I had to bow out. So after many attempts, I secured a solo deal though Simmons Records, oddly enough. It was right as the grunge thing was coming along so I got my ass kicked there. I was dropped and here comes Nirvana! [laughs]

https://www.antimusic.com/news/16/May/t ... omet.shtml


Tod on $Immons Records. Gene could sure "pick em"
Do you know why Maiden was "constantly canceling shows"?
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Re: David lee roth

Post by LordThurisaz »

DonnaDixon wrote: Mon Jul 05, 2021 2:13 pm Do you know why Maiden was "constantly canceling shows"?
Probably due to sales of the album and the tour, if memory serves. Frankly, Bruce can call metalheads "too conservative" and refer to "metal ghettos," but the truth is that Seventh Son was a dog shit album. I love synths, Brucey boy, but they don't go well with a Maiden record. I think Bruce and Slash refer to the tour in their books.
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Re: David lee roth

Post by DonnaDixon »

LordThurisaz wrote: Mon Jul 05, 2021 2:54 pm
DonnaDixon wrote: Mon Jul 05, 2021 2:13 pm Do you know why Maiden was "constantly canceling shows"?
Probably due to sales of the album and the tour, if memory serves. Frankly, Bruce can call metalheads "too conservative" and refer to "metal ghettos," but the truth is that Seventh Son was a dog shit album. I love synths, Brucey boy, but they don't go well with a Maiden record. I think Bruce and Slash refer to the tour in their books.
He talked about metal ghettos?
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Re: David lee roth

Post by Bruce »

DonnaDixon wrote: Mon Jul 05, 2021 1:48 pm What would you say are Bruce's finest moments?
Too many to specify, but ... Unplugged would not have been as exceptional without Bruce Kulick. He saved that ocassion and -- whether intentionally, or not -- really sold the Reunion, that night. Its a credit to his professionalism that, despite knowing he was out of the band, he still gave it his best shot, as always.
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Re: David lee roth

Post by LordThurisaz »

DonnaDixon wrote: Mon Jul 05, 2021 3:03 pm
LordThurisaz wrote: Mon Jul 05, 2021 2:54 pm
DonnaDixon wrote: Mon Jul 05, 2021 2:13 pm Do you know why Maiden was "constantly canceling shows"?
Probably due to sales of the album and the tour, if memory serves. Frankly, Bruce can call metalheads "too conservative" and refer to "metal ghettos," but the truth is that Seventh Son was a dog shit album. I love synths, Brucey boy, but they don't go well with a Maiden record. I think Bruce and Slash refer to the tour in their books.
He talked about metal ghettos?
If memory serves -- it has been awhile since I've read his book -- Bruce referred to metal fans as "musically conservative" and he seemed sort of disparaging about the genre, referring to it as "metal ghettoes." He's been kind of rude to people for not liking SSOASS since the 80s.
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Re: David lee roth

Post by DonnaDixon »

LordThurisaz wrote: Mon Jul 05, 2021 3:49 pm
DonnaDixon wrote: Mon Jul 05, 2021 3:03 pm
LordThurisaz wrote: Mon Jul 05, 2021 2:54 pm
DonnaDixon wrote: Mon Jul 05, 2021 2:13 pm Do you know why Maiden was "constantly canceling shows"?
Probably due to sales of the album and the tour, if memory serves. Frankly, Bruce can call metalheads "too conservative" and refer to "metal ghettos," but the truth is that Seventh Son was a dog shit album. I love synths, Brucey boy, but they don't go well with a Maiden record. I think Bruce and Slash refer to the tour in their books.
He talked about metal ghettos?
If memory serves -- it has been awhile since I've read his book -- Bruce referred to metal fans as "musically conservative" and he seemed sort of disparaging about the genre, referring to it as "metal ghettoes." He's been kind of rude to people for not liking SSOASS since the 80s.
I take it he loved that album?
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Re: David lee roth

Post by muddfoot »

So,who’s opening for KISS
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LordThurisaz
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Re: David lee roth

Post by LordThurisaz »

muddfoot wrote: Mon Jul 05, 2021 9:30 pm So,who’s opening for KISS
An interpretive dancer.