How to appease fans who can't do any "Vault" experience?

Post by **Admin** » Sat Sep 16, 2017 10:08 am

This is something I think Gene is missing the point on, though there are obviously business "things" in the background to which fans are not privy. Advertising. Showing up on a few news/radio outlets, or relying on rock news site or fans, is one thing. But don't forget about those digital platforms you dislike so strongly. We know you've got throwaway tracks that would never make a box. Should have used "Are You Ready" as a freebie, call it a single if you will. And perhaps bundled with some non-Vault alternate tracks, maybe the best of what already circulates in collector's circles! "Here's a taste of the sort of stuff you'll be able to hear on the 'Vault' and a thank you to those who've supported my for 50 years." And boom, iTunes / digital / vinyl EP or full-length. I still stand by he thought that a Cult-like idea like "Best of Rare Cult" would be a great mass-market release that wouldn't damage the exclusivity of the Vault - maybe the Producer Experience folk will get to pick the track-listing. Opinions vary, I guess I just always want MORE!

So, I'd do a single volume release featuring the best SQ versions from Gene's "Vault" that has circulated for years. He's really never benefitted from it anyway, so put it out as an all-or-nothing digital album, except for the one "single" track... Then license up a signed gatefold double-LP in blood red vinyl at $199 chock full of advertising for the vault. The songs I'd select are some of my favorites from collecting (and yes, some are even recycled from assorted bonus discs Gene has previously issued):

01. Stanley The Parrot
02. Howling For Your Love
03. So Many Girls, So Little Time
04. Rotten To The Core
05. Nite Fly
06. High And Low
07. Burning Up With Fever (KISS Demo)
08. I Don't Want Your Romance
09. Fourever
10. Love Came To Me
11. I Have Just Begun To Fight (w/ Virgin)
12. It's Gonna Be Alright
13. Something Wicked This Way Comes
14. Nobody's Perfect
15. Everybody Knows
16. You're My Reason For Livin'
17. Rain Keeps Fallin'
18. I Wanna Rule The World
19. Are You Ready (A Taste From The Vault)

Gotta let Fanucci wet his beak a little...

goinblind · Post by **goinblind** » Sat Sep 16, 2017 11:52 am

I guess if he's going in to locate, clean up and master the vault, it wouldn't cost anything more to do this as a digital release. But honestly, it would sell a couple of hundred digital copies and that's it. And it might knock off a noticeable amount of people who are on the fence about the $2,000 Meet & Greet.

Grizzly Adams · Post by **Grizzly Adams** » Sat Sep 16, 2017 12:07 pm

Admin,
How do you know if Gene is not including tracks 1-18 that you mention above in his official $2k vault release?

kissjrj · Post by **kissjrj** » Sat Sep 16, 2017 12:20 pm

Say hi to Gino. This is at Electric Lady Studios.

Gene Simmons
Thank you to Gino from Florida for being our New York City executive producer! Toronto you can be next!

Sam · Post by **Sam** » Sun Sep 17, 2017 4:18 am

I'm sure there will eventually be a cheapo version, we just have to wait until Gene wrings every penny out of the "Vault Experience".

Rhiannon · Post by **Rhiannon** » Sun Sep 17, 2017 5:44 am

Great post admin, but i too think a lot of those tracks you mentioned will appear as part of the vault.But i really think, maybe 12 months or so we will see another release of these songs in a cheaper format.

Post by **Klankh79** » Sun Sep 17, 2017 5:55 am

thats the coolest street clothes outfit he's had on since the Revenge tour.

Rhiannon · Post by **Rhiannon** » Sun Sep 17, 2017 6:02 am

kissjrj wrote:Say hi to Gino. This is at Electric Lady Studios.

Gene Simmons
Thank you to Gino from Florida for being our New York City executive producer! Toronto you can be next!

Can someone explain, is this a fan who paid for the experience at producing?

Curveboy · Post by **Curveboy** » Sun Sep 17, 2017 6:39 am

You need a $100-150 option for the 10 CD's plus a softcover book.
You can put it in a cheap cardboard box with paper/cardboard sleeves for each disc.

For those of us who have stuck with this band for decades and want to support the artist but can't afford to not put food on the table for it.

Kissologist · Post by **Kissologist** » Sun Sep 17, 2017 6:49 am

kissjrj wrote:Say hi to Gino. This is at Electric Lady Studios.

Gene Simmons
Thank you to Gino from Florida for being our New York City executive producer! Toronto you can be next!

Let's get Gino's digits pronto.
We could have the first leaks of the material

:mrgreen:

asamphord · Post by **asamphord** » Sun Sep 17, 2017 8:03 am

Kissologist wrote:
kissjrj wrote:Say hi to Gino. This is at Electric Lady Studios.

Gene Simmons
Thank you to Gino from Florida for being our New York City executive producer! Toronto you can be next!

Let's get Gino's digits pronto.
We could have the first leaks of the material
:mrgreen:

Gino is easily found on Facebook, doesn't have copies of any of the music yet, and, based on what I can learn about him from his facebook wall, is highly doubtful to be the type of person to spend cash on something and then give it away for free.

mybliesad · Post by **mybliesad** » Sun Sep 17, 2017 8:06 am

I'm with those who say someone will put this on line so we'll all be able to hear it. I just hope when it appears online they put up the links on this site.

asamphord · Post by **asamphord** » Sun Sep 17, 2017 8:21 am

mybliesad wrote:I'm with those who say someone will put this on line so we'll all be able to hear it. I just hope when it appears online they put up the links on this site.

Crimson Harpoon · Post by **Crimson Harpoon** » Sun Sep 17, 2017 8:51 am

I don't even want the vault experience. Just offer a set of discs at a reasonable price & I would possibly be interested.

Erwin · Post by **Erwin** » Sun Sep 17, 2017 12:53 pm

Curveboy wrote:You need a $100-150 option for the 10 CD's plus a softcover book.
You can put it in a cheap cardboard box with paper/cardboard sleeves for each disc.

For those of us who have stuck with this band for decades and want to support the artist but can't afford to not put food on the table for it.

That's all it takes.

Ironfist76 · Post by **Ironfist76** » Sun Sep 17, 2017 1:30 pm

Time & patience is on my side. When the no-frills version comes out, it'll be mine.

Australia1980 · Post by **Australia1980** » Sun Sep 17, 2017 2:13 pm

Sam wrote:I'm sure there will eventually be a cheapo version, we just have to wait until Gene wrings every penny out of the "Vault Experience".

This. I remember when they did the KISS boxed set, there was a guitar case, then a little ukulele sized case, then the black box. I bought the black box.

In fact, there doesn't even need to be a box. All he needs to do is shrinkwrap a stack of CD's together and I'll be happy.

LordThurisaz · Post by **LordThurisaz** » Sun Sep 17, 2017 2:29 pm

Crimson Harpoon wrote:I don't even want the vault experience. Just offer a set of discs at a reasonable price & I would possibly be interested.

I want the version after you've sifted through all of the garbage and debris. I don't need to hear a bunch of extra shit with zero to offer other than a curious idea of what Gene thinks constitutes as a song.

peopleselbow · Post by **peopleselbow** » Sun Sep 17, 2017 4:31 pm

Along with the ridiculous price is that the songs will most likely suck.

Crimson Harpoon · Post by **Crimson Harpoon** » Sun Sep 17, 2017 4:36 pm

LordThurisaz wrote:
Crimson Harpoon wrote:I don't even want the vault experience. Just offer a set of discs at a reasonable price & I would possibly be interested.
I want the version after you've sifted through all of the garbage and debris. I don't need to hear a bunch of extra shit with zero to offer other than a curious idea of what Gene thinks constitutes as a song.

That's where the reasonable price part comes in. It goes hand in hand with what the package actually contains. A set of 10 discs full of great material would be worth more than 10 discs filled with throwaway horseshit. I just bought a 27 disc box set of the complete King of Queens series for $28 & change, so what are 10 discs of music demos really worth? If Gene were Prince, John Lennon or Michael Jackson...

asamphord · Post by **asamphord** » Sun Sep 17, 2017 4:39 pm

Crimson Harpoon wrote: If Gene were Prince, John Lennon or Michael Jackson...

i'm far more interested and fascinated by Gene's songwriting and recording process than I am anyone else you mentioned, by a longshot.

mybliesad · Post by **mybliesad** » Sun Sep 17, 2017 4:41 pm

Crimson Harpoon wrote:
LordThurisaz wrote:
Crimson Harpoon wrote:I don't even want the vault experience. Just offer a set of discs at a reasonable price & I would possibly be interested.
I want the version after you've sifted through all of the garbage and debris. I don't need to hear a bunch of extra shit with zero to offer other than a curious idea of what Gene thinks constitutes as a song.
That's where the reasonable price part comes in. It goes hand in hand with what the package actually contains. A set of 10 discs full of great material would be worth more than 10 discs filled with throwaway horseshit. I just bought a 27 disc box set of the complete King of Queens series for $28 & change, so what are 10 discs of music demos really worth? If Gene were Prince, John Lennon or Michael Jackson...

You can get the Beatles complete CD collection at Walmart for $199.00

Crimson Harpoon · Post by **Crimson Harpoon** » Sun Sep 17, 2017 4:45 pm

mybliesad wrote:
Crimson Harpoon wrote:
LordThurisaz wrote:
Crimson Harpoon wrote:I don't even want the vault experience. Just offer a set of discs at a reasonable price & I would possibly be interested.
I want the version after you've sifted through all of the garbage and debris. I don't need to hear a bunch of extra shit with zero to offer other than a curious idea of what Gene thinks constitutes as a song.
That's where the reasonable price part comes in. It goes hand in hand with what the package actually contains. A set of 10 discs full of great material would be worth more than 10 discs filled with throwaway horseshit. I just bought a 27 disc box set of the complete King of Queens series for $28 & change, so what are 10 discs of music demos really worth? If Gene were Prince, John Lennon or Michael Jackson...
You can get the Beatles complete CD collection at Walmart for $199.00

Yet Gene expects his fans to shell out $2,000 for a box of unreleased material.

That said, it (Gene's vault) is unreleased material, which might be worth more than a simple box of everything already available. But again, Gene is no Beatles.

LordThurisaz · Post by **LordThurisaz** » Sun Sep 17, 2017 4:51 pm

Crimson Harpoon wrote:
LordThurisaz wrote:
Crimson Harpoon wrote:I don't even want the vault experience. Just offer a set of discs at a reasonable price & I would possibly be interested.
I want the version after you've sifted through all of the garbage and debris. I don't need to hear a bunch of extra shit with zero to offer other than a curious idea of what Gene thinks constitutes as a song.
That's where the reasonable price part comes in. It goes hand in hand with what the package actually contains. A set of 10 discs full of great material would be worth more than 10 discs filled with throwaway horseshit. I just bought a 27 disc box set of the complete King of Queens series for $28 & change, so what are 10 discs of music demos really worth? If Gene were Prince, John Lennon or Michael Jackson...

I can get an EVH 5150IIIS for around 2k. Or a bunch of guitar pedals. Or a new guitar. Gene thinking this is worth 2k [I really don't care to be in smelly Gene's presence for 5 minutes] is hilarious. Frankly, I'd spend the money on a nice power amp, which would actually be useful, over this junk drawer full of Gene's assorted stuff. And you're right, Gene is no Prince, John Lennon, Michael Jackson, etc.

Crimson Harpoon wrote:Yet Gene expects his fans to shell out $2,000 for a box of unreleased material.

That said, it (Gene's vault) is unreleased material, which might be worth more than a simple box of everything already available. But again, Gene is no Beatles

But Crimson, 2k is for the "experience." I'd rather experience an EVH 5150IIIS with the volume on 5.

savage_dreams · Post by **savage_dreams** » Sun Sep 17, 2017 4:52 pm

Crimson Harpoon wrote: I just bought a 27 disc box set of the complete King of Queens series for $28 & change, so what are 10 discs of music demos

the example works, but against you. King of Queens already had been released before, in a more expensive way. i dont remember the exact price, but ill guess it was probably $20-$30 for each season. like everything else it eventually got released in a bargain format.

just like genes stuff, it will eventually be released in a cheaper format. anyone who thinks that this vault experience is the only way this set is ever going to be released is a moron.

Crimson Harpoon · Post by **Crimson Harpoon** » Sun Sep 17, 2017 4:55 pm

LordThurisaz wrote:
Crimson Harpoon wrote:
LordThurisaz wrote:
Crimson Harpoon wrote:I don't even want the vault experience. Just offer a set of discs at a reasonable price & I would possibly be interested.
I want the version after you've sifted through all of the garbage and debris. I don't need to hear a bunch of extra shit with zero to offer other than a curious idea of what Gene thinks constitutes as a song.
That's where the reasonable price part comes in. It goes hand in hand with what the package actually contains. A set of 10 discs full of great material would be worth more than 10 discs filled with throwaway horseshit. I just bought a 27 disc box set of the complete King of Queens series for $28 & change, so what are 10 discs of music demos really worth? If Gene were Prince, John Lennon or Michael Jackson...
I can get an EVH 5150IIIS for around 2k. Or a bunch of guitar pedals. Or a new guitar. Gene thinking this is worth 2k [I really don't care to be in smelly Gene's presence for 5 minutes] is hilarious. Frankly, I'd spend the money on a nice power amp, which would actually be useful, over this junk drawer full of Gene's assorted stuff. And you're right, Gene is no Prince, John Lennon, Michael Jackson, etc.

Crimson Harpoon wrote:Yet Gene expects his fans to shell out $2,000 for a box of unreleased material.

That said, it (Gene's vault) is unreleased material, which might be worth more than a simple box of everything already available. But again, Gene is no Beatles
But Crimson, 2k is for the "experience." I'd rather experience an EVH 5150IIIS with the volume on 5.

Or a pair of these to listen to real music on...

https://www.crutchfield.com/p_336REVA4R ... ewood.html

LordThurisaz · Post by **LordThurisaz** » Sun Sep 17, 2017 4:57 pm

Crimson Harpoon wrote:
LordThurisaz wrote:
Crimson Harpoon wrote:
LordThurisaz wrote:
Crimson Harpoon wrote:I don't even want the vault experience. Just offer a set of discs at a reasonable price & I would possibly be interested.
I want the version after you've sifted through all of the garbage and debris. I don't need to hear a bunch of extra shit with zero to offer other than a curious idea of what Gene thinks constitutes as a song.
That's where the reasonable price part comes in. It goes hand in hand with what the package actually contains. A set of 10 discs full of great material would be worth more than 10 discs filled with throwaway horseshit. I just bought a 27 disc box set of the complete King of Queens series for $28 & change, so what are 10 discs of music demos really worth? If Gene were Prince, John Lennon or Michael Jackson...
I can get an EVH 5150IIIS for around 2k. Or a bunch of guitar pedals. Or a new guitar. Gene thinking this is worth 2k [I really don't care to be in smelly Gene's presence for 5 minutes] is hilarious. Frankly, I'd spend the money on a nice power amp, which would actually be useful, over this junk drawer full of Gene's assorted stuff. And you're right, Gene is no Prince, John Lennon, Michael Jackson, etc.

Crimson Harpoon wrote:Yet Gene expects his fans to shell out $2,000 for a box of unreleased material.

That said, it (Gene's vault) is unreleased material, which might be worth more than a simple box of everything already available. But again, Gene is no Beatles
But Crimson, 2k is for the "experience." I'd rather experience an EVH 5150IIIS with the volume on 5.
Or a pair of these to listen to real music on...

https://www.crutchfield.com/p_336REVA4R ... ewood.html

The power amp would be for guitar, not music. Those speakers probably would sound pretty awesome though.

Crimson Harpoon · Post by **Crimson Harpoon** » Sun Sep 17, 2017 4:58 pm

LordThurisaz wrote:
Crimson Harpoon wrote:
LordThurisaz wrote:
Crimson Harpoon wrote:
LordThurisaz wrote:
Crimson Harpoon wrote:I don't even want the vault experience. Just offer a set of discs at a reasonable price & I would possibly be interested.
I want the version after you've sifted through all of the garbage and debris. I don't need to hear a bunch of extra shit with zero to offer other than a curious idea of what Gene thinks constitutes as a song.
That's where the reasonable price part comes in. It goes hand in hand with what the package actually contains. A set of 10 discs full of great material would be worth more than 10 discs filled with throwaway horseshit. I just bought a 27 disc box set of the complete King of Queens series for $28 & change, so what are 10 discs of music demos really worth? If Gene were Prince, John Lennon or Michael Jackson...
I can get an EVH 5150IIIS for around 2k. Or a bunch of guitar pedals. Or a new guitar. Gene thinking this is worth 2k [I really don't care to be in smelly Gene's presence for 5 minutes] is hilarious. Frankly, I'd spend the money on a nice power amp, which would actually be useful, over this junk drawer full of Gene's assorted stuff. And you're right, Gene is no Prince, John Lennon, Michael Jackson, etc.

Crimson Harpoon wrote:Yet Gene expects his fans to shell out $2,000 for a box of unreleased material.

That said, it (Gene's vault) is unreleased material, which might be worth more than a simple box of everything already available. But again, Gene is no Beatles
But Crimson, 2k is for the "experience." I'd rather experience an EVH 5150IIIS with the volume on 5.
Or a pair of these to listen to real music on...

https://www.crutchfield.com/p_336REVA4R ... ewood.html
The power amp would be for guitar, not music. Those speakers probably would sound pretty awesome though.

Yeah, I know. I was just naming something I'd rather spend $2,000 on... 5 entire carts full of shit at Dollar Tree?

LordThurisaz · Post by **LordThurisaz** » Sun Sep 17, 2017 5:40 pm

Crimson Harpoon wrote:
LordThurisaz wrote:
Crimson Harpoon wrote:
LordThurisaz wrote:
Crimson Harpoon wrote:
LordThurisaz wrote:
Crimson Harpoon wrote:I don't even want the vault experience. Just offer a set of discs at a reasonable price & I would possibly be interested.
I want the version after you've sifted through all of the garbage and debris. I don't need to hear a bunch of extra shit with zero to offer other than a curious idea of what Gene thinks constitutes as a song.
That's where the reasonable price part comes in. It goes hand in hand with what the package actually contains. A set of 10 discs full of great material would be worth more than 10 discs filled with throwaway horseshit. I just bought a 27 disc box set of the complete King of Queens series for $28 & change, so what are 10 discs of music demos really worth? If Gene were Prince, John Lennon or Michael Jackson...
I can get an EVH 5150IIIS for around 2k. Or a bunch of guitar pedals. Or a new guitar. Gene thinking this is worth 2k [I really don't care to be in smelly Gene's presence for 5 minutes] is hilarious. Frankly, I'd spend the money on a nice power amp, which would actually be useful, over this junk drawer full of Gene's assorted stuff. And you're right, Gene is no Prince, John Lennon, Michael Jackson, etc.

Crimson Harpoon wrote:Yet Gene expects his fans to shell out $2,000 for a box of unreleased material.

That said, it (Gene's vault) is unreleased material, which might be worth more than a simple box of everything already available. But again, Gene is no Beatles
But Crimson, 2k is for the "experience." I'd rather experience an EVH 5150IIIS with the volume on 5.
Or a pair of these to listen to real music on...

https://www.crutchfield.com/p_336REVA4R ... ewood.html
The power amp would be for guitar, not music. Those speakers probably would sound pretty awesome though.
Yeah, I know. I was just naming something I'd rather spend $2,000 on... 5 entire carts full of shit at Dollar Tree?

~1,500-2,000 songs on iTunes.

kiss-1976 · Post by **kiss-1976** » Sun Sep 17, 2017 5:57 pm

I don't believe the online bitching is necessarily about the $2000, $25,000 or $50,000 costs.
It's a personal choice as to how people spend their own cash.
It's because there isn't an option for fans just to buy a regular reasonably priced box set without having to meet Gene to get one.
At this point anyway...

Post by **elleneff** » Mon Sep 18, 2017 2:12 am

Interesting point Admin.
Appease fans who cant do it. Assuming they want to of course.
If you cant afford a Vault 2k Experience, then a Kiss Kruise and potentially a 1K KISS meet and greet is out of reach too.
Nothing wrong with that, people have to judge priorities and cashflow and decide if its worth it to them.

Its noted some are selling bits and pieces of merch and collectibles to fund this and I say, cool, more power to you.

I can only speak for me, Personally like a few, If I had a few K lying around, Id rather buy a Jemm777 or an Iceman or an SG of an EVH 5150 Frankenstrat .
Or put it into the Old Jag XJS.
Iv meet Gene a few times, It cost me nothing. I place no value at meeting him again in an era where, lets face it , there are so many signed bits out there, an unsigned Gene glossy is probably worth more.
Having the original 4 sign on an original 74 tour poster? Id have that.
A Lick it up tour poster, with Vinnie Gene Eric and Paul? yeah I can see value on that. Its a time capsule, a moment captured with the 4 signatures.

To each their own of course. Ill wait till a bottom end set is available or its streamed on Deezer. Ill pay to hear it. Just no more than its actually worth.

Post by **Klankh79** » Mon Sep 18, 2017 8:29 am

im with you guys who would pay for a no frills version of the set. im curious enough about the supposed horseshit and stuff that wasnt good enough to sift thru it all, even if at the end i feel like i overpaid. i am willing to take that chance. but again, not for more than the price of a decent seat to a concert or so.

Post by **aceshigh** » Mon Sep 18, 2017 8:40 am

Well it is working. You guys are all desperate to get your grubs on this thing. It is funny that you all slag COS and the 80's, but you all want the demos from those eras lol. Get a grip it is a collection of shitty demos for fuck sakes. There will be no new Black Diamond in this package. You may get a demo of Boomerang though fucking exciting isn't it?

Post by **Klankh79** » Mon Sep 18, 2017 8:44 am

aceshigh wrote: Get a grip it is a collection of shitty demos for fuck sakes.

yeah, but Gene's shitty demos are interesting in their own right. kinda like how i purposely set out to watch what are obviously terrible movies sometimes, bcuz the fun is in how bad it is. given the lack of new material for the last 20 years i am actually quite eager to hear this stuff. but like someone else said, at its proper value.

LordThurisaz · Post by **LordThurisaz** » Mon Sep 18, 2017 9:05 am

aceshigh wrote:Well it is working. You guys are all desperate to get your grubs on this thing. It is funny that you all slag COS and the 80's, but you all want the demos from those eras lol. Get a grip it is a collection of shitty demos for fuck sakes. There will be no new Black Diamond in this package. You may get a demo of Boomerang though fucking exciting isn't it?

This.

tomwabe · Post by **tomwabe** » Mon Sep 18, 2017 9:51 am

It's going to need to be a two way appeasement though, isn't it? And that's not, ultimately, good for business. There's the appeasement you're suggesting here - which is throwing a bone to those of us who - and let's get this straight as most of us here are men of some means - won't pay the stupid asking price rather than can't pay the stupid asking price. Then there's the appeasement that, I guess, also won't be forthcoming to those who are still meeting loan repayments when / if this thing hits HMV in a cute little card safe six months down the line.

There actually are no holy grails here - this isn't something I could drop far more on, personally, than, say a first album promo or even a good condition first tour book. That's where real magic resides. Those aren't 'manufactured' collector's items. Gene's shonky safe is aimed at the terminally bamboozled- like something from Franklin Mint.

I'm a huge Gene fan but I can't for the life of me see why this collection is allowed out from under the KISS franchise? Those who have wondered on Paul's reaction to this have a real point. These were, for the most part, demo's made for KISS projects. They are, the ones we're interested in, actually, KISS demos. Why wasn't this stuff compiled and edited to include work from both major songwriters and issued under the classic logo?

LordThurisaz · Post by **LordThurisaz** » Mon Sep 18, 2017 9:53 am

tomwabe wrote:It's going to need to be a two way appeasement though, isn't it? And that's not, ultimately, good for business. There's the appeasement you're suggesting here - which is throwing a bone to those of us who - and let's get this straight as most of us here are men of some means - won't pay the stupid asking price rather than can't pay the stupid asking price. Then there's the appeasement that, I guess, also won't be forthcoming to those who are still meeting loan repayments when if this thing hits HMV in a cute little card safe six months down the line.

There actually are no holy grails here - this isn't something I could drop far more on, personally, than, say a first album promo or even a good condition first tour book. That's where real magic resides. Those aren't 'manufactured' collector's items. Gene's shonky safe is aimed at the teminally confused - like something from Franklin Mint.

I'm a huge Gene fan but I can't for the life of me see why this collection is allowed out from under the KISS franchise? Those who have wondered on Paul's reaction to this have a real point. These were, for the most part, demo's made for KISS projects. They are, the ones we're interested in, actually, KISS demos. Why wasn't this stuff compiled and edited to include work from both major songwriters and issued under the classic logo?

Yet again, this.

highvoltage1969 · Post by **highvoltage1969** » Mon Sep 18, 2017 10:19 am

tomwabe wrote:It's going to need to be a two way appeasement though, isn't it? And that's not, ultimately, good for business. There's the appeasement you're suggesting here - which is throwing a bone to those of us who - and let's get this straight as most of us here are men of some means - won't pay the stupid asking price rather than can't pay the stupid asking price. Then there's the appeasement that, I guess, also won't be forthcoming to those who are still meeting loan repayments when / if this thing hits HMV in a cute little card safe six months down the line.

There actually are no holy grails here - this isn't something I could drop far more on, personally, than, say a first album promo or even a good condition first tour book. That's where real magic resides. Those aren't 'manufactured' collector's items. Gene's shonky safe is aimed at the terminally bamboozled- like something from Franklin Mint.

I'm a huge Gene fan but I can't for the life of me see why this collection is allowed out from under the KISS franchise? Those who have wondered on Paul's reaction to this have a real point. These were, for the most part, demo's made for KISS projects. They are, the ones we're interested in, actually, KISS demos. Why wasn't this stuff compiled and edited to include work from both major songwriters and issued under the classic logo?

Brilliant!

highvoltage1969 · Post by **highvoltage1969** » Mon Sep 18, 2017 10:29 am

Admin wrote:This is something I think Gene is missing the point on, though there are obviously business "things" in the background to which fans are not privy. Advertising. Showing up on a few news/radio outlets, or relying on rock news site or fans, is one thing. But don't forget about those digital platforms you dislike so strongly. We know you've got throwaway tracks that would never make a box. Should have used "Are You Ready" as a freebie, call it a single if you will. And perhaps bundled with some non-Vault alternate tracks, maybe the best of what already circulates in collector's circles! "Here's a taste of the sort of stuff you'll be able to hear on the 'Vault' and a thank you to those who've supported my for 50 years." And boom, iTunes / digital / vinyl EP or full-length. I still stand by he thought that a Cult-like idea like "Best of Rare Cult" would be a great mass-market release that wouldn't damage the exclusivity of the Vault - maybe the Producer Experience folk will get to pick the track-listing. Opinions vary, I guess I just always want MORE!

So, I'd do a single volume release featuring the best SQ versions from Gene's "Vault" that has circulated for years. He's really never benefitted from it anyway, so put it out as an all-or-nothing digital album, except for the one "single" track... Then license up a signed gatefold double-LP in blood red vinyl at $199 chock full of advertising for the vault. The songs I'd select are some of my favorites from collecting (and yes, some are even recycled from assorted bonus discs Gene has previously issued):

01. Stanley The Parrot
02. Howling For Your Love
03. So Many Girls, So Little Time
04. Rotten To The Core
05. Nite Fly
06. High And Low
07. Burning Up With Fever (KISS Demo)
08. I Don't Want Your Romance
09. Fourever
10. Love Came To Me
11. I Have Just Begun To Fight (w/ Virgin)
12. It's Gonna Be Alright
13. Something Wicked This Way Comes
14. Nobody's Perfect
15. Everybody Knows
16. You're My Reason For Livin'
17. Rain Keeps Fallin'
18. I Wanna Rule The World
19. Are You Ready (A Taste From The Vault)

Gotta let Fanucci wet his beak a little...

I'd be utterly amazed if anyone was interested in paying for a license to manufacture and sell a 20 track, double (coloured) vinyl gatefold LP of Gene Simmons demos that retailed for $200. You'd haemorrhage money all over the place.

Post by **aceshigh** » Mon Sep 18, 2017 10:35 am

LordThurisaz wrote:
tomwabe wrote:It's going to need to be a two way appeasement though, isn't it? And that's not, ultimately, good for business. There's the appeasement you're suggesting here - which is throwing a bone to those of us who - and let's get this straight as most of us here are men of some means - won't pay the stupid asking price rather than can't pay the stupid asking price. Then there's the appeasement that, I guess, also won't be forthcoming to those who are still meeting loan repayments when if this thing hits HMV in a cute little card safe six months down the line.

There actually are no holy grails here - this isn't something I could drop far more on, personally, than, say a first album promo or even a good condition first tour book. That's where real magic resides. Those aren't 'manufactured' collector's items. Gene's shonky safe is aimed at the teminally confused - like something from Franklin Mint.

I'm a huge Gene fan but I can't for the life of me see why this collection is allowed out from under the KISS franchise? Those who have wondered on Paul's reaction to this have a real point. These were, for the most part, demo's made for KISS projects. They are, the ones we're interested in, actually, KISS demos. Why wasn't this stuff compiled and edited to include work from both major songwriters and issued under the classic logo?
Yet again, this.

If it was of any quality, Paul would want his name on it as well. It will be a steaming pile. I want to see the running time of this set. 150 one minute songs?

Post by **Klankh79** » Mon Sep 18, 2017 10:44 am

if Paul is griping about anything, its probably rooted in jealousy. no one is making fun of Gene's voice. Gene remains an intriguing enough celebrity to make an offering like this a viable proposition. Paul can only paint.

Sssnakester · Post by **Sssnakester** » Mon Sep 18, 2017 11:04 am

kiss-1976 wrote:I don't believe the online bitching is necessarily about the $2000, $25,000 or $50,000 costs.
It's a personal choice as to how people spend their own cash.
It's because there isn't an option for fans just to buy a regular reasonably priced box set without having to meet Gene to get one.
At this point anyway...

This is EXACTLY it. I can't for the life of me figure out why that's so hard for some to comprehend

LordThurisaz · Post by **LordThurisaz** » Mon Sep 18, 2017 5:13 pm

Klankh79 wrote:if Paul is griping about anything, its probably rooted in jealousy. no one is making fun of Gene's voice. Gene remains an intriguing enough celebrity to make an offering like this a viable proposition. Paul can only paint.

Does Paul blow huge gravity bong sized puffs of smoke up people's ass about "doing it for the fans" when he does his ugly, 3rd grade fingerpainting pieces of artwork though?

LordThurisaz · Post by **LordThurisaz** » Mon Sep 18, 2017 5:14 pm

Sssnakester wrote:
kiss-1976 wrote:I don't believe the online bitching is necessarily about the $2000, $25,000 or $50,000 costs.
It's a personal choice as to how people spend their own cash.
It's because there isn't an option for fans just to buy a regular reasonably priced box set without having to meet Gene to get one.
At this point anyway...
This is EXACTLY it. I can't for the life of me figure out why that's so hard for some to comprehend

Because those people would much rather look down at you and insinuating you're a broke peiece of shit just because you aren't, in the immortal words of tomwabe, a legend among mere mortals, "terminally bamboozled." Gene can cram the gaudy, tawdry safe, the scarf [seriously? this is real?], the book of ego inflating for songs that couldn't cut the mustard and other typical blowhard shit he pumps into everything he does, the goofy coin, the silly Knucklbonz style statue... most of the fans just want a fucking 10 CD set with a simple box and a simple CD booklet like in the awesome, awesome 2 disc best of box set Rhino did with a decent 64 page booklet. The rest of that overpriced windowdressing is meant to make it look better than it is, but is really just a bath house in a red light district.

Vandelay Industries · Post by **Vandelay Industries** » Mon Sep 18, 2017 6:01 pm

LordThurisaz wrote:
Sssnakester wrote:
kiss-1976 wrote:I don't believe the online bitching is necessarily about the $2000, $25,000 or $50,000 costs.
It's a personal choice as to how people spend their own cash.
It's because there isn't an option for fans just to buy a regular reasonably priced box set without having to meet Gene to get one.
At this point anyway...
This is EXACTLY it. I can't for the life of me figure out why that's so hard for some to comprehend
Because those people would much rather look down at you and insinuating you're a broke peiece of shit just because you aren't, in the immortal words of tomwabe, a legend among mere mortals, "terminally bamboozled." Gene can cram the gaudy, tawdry safe, the scarf [seriously? this is real?], the book of ego inflating for songs that couldn't cut the mustard and other typical blowhard shit he pumps into everything he does, the goofy coin, the silly Knucklbonz style statue... most of the fans just want a fucking 10 CD set with a simple box and a simple CD booklet like in the awesome, awesome 2 disc best of box set Rhino did with a decent 64 page booklet. The rest of that overpriced windowdressing is meant to make it look better than it is, but is really just a bath house in a red light district.

What's cracking me up is that some of these hoarder club members are already trying to use parental-type warnings to scare people from leaking the tracks. I personally DGAF enough to make any effort to hit the pirate sites, but the fact that there's already some apparent one-upsmanship in the air over these tracks, I'll be giggling when--not if--these songs start leaking....

asamphord · Post by **asamphord** » Mon Sep 18, 2017 6:08 pm

Vandelay Industries wrote:
LordThurisaz wrote:
Sssnakester wrote:
kiss-1976 wrote:I don't believe the online bitching is necessarily about the $2000, $25,000 or $50,000 costs.
It's a personal choice as to how people spend their own cash.
It's because there isn't an option for fans just to buy a regular reasonably priced box set without having to meet Gene to get one.
At this point anyway...
This is EXACTLY it. I can't for the life of me figure out why that's so hard for some to comprehend
Because those people would much rather look down at you and insinuating you're a broke peiece of shit just because you aren't, in the immortal words of tomwabe, a legend among mere mortals, "terminally bamboozled." Gene can cram the gaudy, tawdry safe, the scarf [seriously? this is real?], the book of ego inflating for songs that couldn't cut the mustard and other typical blowhard shit he pumps into everything he does, the goofy coin, the silly Knucklbonz style statue... most of the fans just want a fucking 10 CD set with a simple box and a simple CD booklet like in the awesome, awesome 2 disc best of box set Rhino did with a decent 64 page booklet. The rest of that overpriced windowdressing is meant to make it look better than it is, but is really just a bath house in a red light district.
What's cracking me up is that some of these hoarder club members are already trying to use parental-type warnings to scare people from leaking the tracks. I personally DGAF enough to make any effort to hit the pirate sites, but the fact that there's already some apparent one-upsmanship in the air over these tracks, I'll be giggling when--not if--these songs start leaking....

happy to be your huckleberry.

Vandelay Industries · Post by **Vandelay Industries** » Mon Sep 18, 2017 6:13 pm

asamphord wrote:
Vandelay Industries wrote:
LordThurisaz wrote:
Sssnakester wrote:
kiss-1976 wrote:I don't believe the online bitching is necessarily about the $2000, $25,000 or $50,000 costs.
It's a personal choice as to how people spend their own cash.
It's because there isn't an option for fans just to buy a regular reasonably priced box set without having to meet Gene to get one.
At this point anyway...
This is EXACTLY it. I can't for the life of me figure out why that's so hard for some to comprehend
Because those people would much rather look down at you and insinuating you're a broke peiece of shit just because you aren't, in the immortal words of tomwabe, a legend among mere mortals, "terminally bamboozled." Gene can cram the gaudy, tawdry safe, the scarf [seriously? this is real?], the book of ego inflating for songs that couldn't cut the mustard and other typical blowhard shit he pumps into everything he does, the goofy coin, the silly Knucklbonz style statue... most of the fans just want a fucking 10 CD set with a simple box and a simple CD booklet like in the awesome, awesome 2 disc best of box set Rhino did with a decent 64 page booklet. The rest of that overpriced windowdressing is meant to make it look better than it is, but is really just a bath house in a red light district.
What's cracking me up is that some of these hoarder club members are already trying to use parental-type warnings to scare people from leaking the tracks. I personally DGAF enough to make any effort to hit the pirate sites, but the fact that there's already some apparent one-upsmanship in the air over these tracks, I'll be giggling when--not if--these songs start leaking....
happy to be your huckleberry.

LordThurisaz · Post by **LordThurisaz** » Mon Sep 18, 2017 6:30 pm

Vandelay Industries wrote:What's cracking me up is that some of these hoarder club members are already trying to use parental-type warnings to scare people from leaking the tracks. I personally DGAF enough to make any effort to hit the pirate sites, but the fact that there's already some apparent one-upsmanship in the air over these tracks, I'll be giggling when--not if--these songs start leaking....

A bunch of clowns defending the availability of music by people who most think dress up to look like clowns.

Yeah, they're beyond silly. Someone needs to leak the full enchilada.

highvoltage1969 · Post by **highvoltage1969** » Tue Sep 19, 2017 7:11 am

Rhiannon wrote:
kissjrj wrote:Say hi to Gino. This is at Electric Lady Studios.

Gene Simmons
Thank you to Gino from Florida for being our New York City executive producer! Toronto you can be next!

Can someone explain, is this a fan who paid for the experience at producing?

God know, he look's deranged, which I'm guessing is a mandatory requirement for the $25K 'executive producer role-playing experience'.

battra · Post by **battra** » Tue Sep 19, 2017 7:40 am

highvoltage1969 wrote:
Rhiannon wrote:
kissjrj wrote:Say hi to Gino. This is at Electric Lady Studios.

Gene Simmons
Thank you to Gino from Florida for being our New York City executive producer! Toronto you can be next!

Can someone explain, is this a fan who paid for the experience at producing?
God know, he look's deranged, which I'm guessing is a mandatory requirement for the $25K 'executive producer role-playing experience'.

I would feel like such a douchebag doing that.

But I also don't play in fantasy hockey leagues or fantasy camp either.